Hollywood Wiretap has relayed a surprising trashing of Martin Scorsese‘s modus operandi these days as well as his forthcoming The Departed, not from some renegade blogger but from the deeply respected cinematographer Christopher Doyle. Doyle reportedly spoke to Hong Kong-based writer Saul Symonds, and his comments were passed along by Grady Hendrix, who writes an Asian film blog for Variety. Doyle is quoted as saying that “it makes me very sad to see Marty and so many others genre-fying and gentrifying himself into mediocrity. Granted, mediocre is not just a Western ailment…but it would seem the disease is malign and endemic.” This is a variation of a criticism that many have thrown at Scorsese over the last ten years or so (starting with his Daniel Day Lewis doilies-and-cufflinks movie), but to hear it from Doyle, who served as visual consultant on Infernal Affairs, the Hong Kong police drama that The Departed is based upon, is more than a bit startling.
yeah, CD is great and all, but I don’t think Marty is quite down the hill yet. Say what you want, nut his last pic, The Aviator (not counting the Dylan doc) was a really good pic. Check it out again. It’s pretty tight for an epic film. Also, he got robbed by Eastwood because, deep down, MDB is atrocious and banal.
I wasn’t aware about all this apparent Scorsese bashing. In my opinion Martin has paid his dues and deserves to make the movies he wants to make. Sure his earlier efforts were gritty, groundbreaking and masterful. Is that to say his later works are not up to snuff? Granted there has not been a Taxi Driver or Goodfellas as of late. The Avaitor was beautifully shot, well acted and daring. Casino wasn[‘t Goodfellas yet look at Sharon Stone’s performance, it was stunning. Even Gang’s of New York is something to behold even though I didn’t care for the Romantic aspects. Daniel Day Lewis was never better in that film.
Not every filmmaker can hit it out of the park every time he/she steps behind the camera. I always thought Martin made a picture that would galvinize moviegoers, challenge us and then he would make a picture for himself. NY, NY, The Dollified pic you already mentioned ect.
I am reminded of the fact that I love Michael Mann movies (All of them, even The Keep) And yet I am not always happy with the way he ends them. Heat and Collateral for instance could have had better endings yet I also was aware of being in the presence of a master storyteller/filmmaker, the same goes with Mr. Scorsese.
Ask Mr. Doyle if he has a Raging Bull in him.
To the Dude or Dudette who first posted… That’s a little rough on MDB don’t ya think? I agree that The Avaitor was a bigger undertaking with incredible visual moments and daring. I was surprised when MDB won the Oscar myself yet to call it atrocious and banal? You of corse are welcomed to tha opinion but we must have seen two different MDBs.
I was in awe what Eastwood did with so little. His last few films have for him been quite stunning with the exception of Space Cowboys. Since The Unforgiven Eastwood has tapped into a place that has produced some amazing work. Yes at times he takes on a project to pay the mortage like Bloodwork but his last two Mystic River and MDB are stunning in their quite desperation and rage.
Well that’s my 2√Ǭ¢ on that.
I can’t believe this is being reported as news. Christopher Doyle was trashing Scorsese in print 9 months ago. Doesn’t anybody read Filmmaker magazine?
“If Martin Scorsese can make a piece of shit called The Aviator and then go on to remake a Hong Kong film, don√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t you think he√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s lost the plot? Think it through. ‘I need my Oscar, I need my fucking Oscar!’ Are you crazy? There√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s not a single person in the Oscar voting department who√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s under 65 years old. They don√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t even know how to get online. They have no idea what the real world is about. They have no visual experience anymore. They have preoccupations. So why the fuck would a great filmmaker need to suck the dick of the Academy with a piece of shit called The Aviator? And now he has to remake our film? I mean this is bullshit. This is total bullshit. I love Marty, I think he√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s a great person. And the other one is Tarantino. Oh yeah, let√¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s appropriate everything. Are you lost? Yes, you are lost.”
If you ask me, those are the words of a borderline crackpot. I’m a big fan of Doyle’s work, but I have friends who have hung out with him and they claim that he’s an out-of-control party guy who’s disillusioned with filmmaking and life in general. Call me crazy, but I get the impression that Doyle is just pissed that he didn’t get to shoot The Departed. Anyway, here’s the complete interview, which makes Doyle’s crackpot status a little more obvious:
http://www.filmmakermagazine.com/fall2005/features/wild_man.php
That quote says all I need to know.
Doyle seems to be the one whose lost the plot, even if Scorsese has in fact gone downhill with his Dicraprio fetish.
Scorsese has definitely lost something recently, and perhaps it is his DiCaprio fetish. The irony is that I think DiCaprio was the best thing about The Aviator aside from the cinematography. I think Million Dollar Baby beat out The Aviator for a number of reasons: Aviator, for all of its qualities, had this feeling of Scorsese saying, “I want an Oscar, I want an Oscar”–I’m sorry, I love Scorsese’s work as much as anyone but it’s true and that’s all there is to it. Eastwood made this little film in 39 days about three characters and they just got it out at the end of the year (wisely) and it connected with the public in a way Aviator didn’t. Now, you could, I suppose, say the same thing about the Dances With Wolves/Goodfellas or Ordinary People (ugh!)/Raging Bull dynamics, *but* the differences were apparent: Million Dollar Baby is, even if you somehow hate it, heartfelt with a filmmaker servicing the film as much as possible and Aviator was, for all of Scorsese’s obvious talent, somehow hollow and failed to create passion. Both films were highly praised by critics, but with Aviator they were talking more about Scorsese’s techniques and how marvelously shot much of it was. With Million Dollar Baby, people were pulverized by it and responded quite powerfully to it. Sure, Ordinary People arguably made a similar impression on a number of critics, although Ordinary People is really bad for a Best Pic nominee and, like Dances With Wolves, is today, destroyed when viewing it against its Scorsese-made rival.
I suppose this could one day happen to Million Dollar Baby. One day people could say, “Why did *that* win?” But I doubt it. There was something to it, and, unlike Raging Bull or Goodfellas, Scorsese’s heart seemed to be missing.
:With Million Dollar Baby, people were pulverized by it and responded quite powerfully to it.
That’s because M$B has something The Aviator & most of Scorsese’s pictures lack; a soul.
I don’t blame Marty for his directorial choices. When his (anti)boxing movie wins 25 years later, because it stars the girl from The Next Karate Kid, instead of DeNiro, something’s definitely gone wrong with the taste of Academy voters.
I happen to have thought both Million Dollar Baby and The Aviator were fantastic. Anyone who doesn’t think The Aviator wasn’t made with passion is obviously missing something. Gangs Of New York is hit and miss but has grown on me overall. Infernal Affairs is Scorcese tapping into a genre he has not yet touched but Doyle (an obvious idiot based on his comments) misses that almost all of Marty’s films…even the non-genre ones…are all interesting because of their fascination with violence and the human condition. Genre or no genre, this is why Marty’s films matter.
I happen to have thought both Million Dollar Baby and The Aviator were fantastic. Anyone who thinks The Aviator wasn’t made with passion is obviously missing something. Gangs Of New York is hit and miss but has grown on me overall. Infernal Affairs is Scorcese tapping into a genre he has not yet touched but Doyle (an obvious idiot based on his comments) misses that almost all of Marty’s films…even the non-genre ones…are all interesting because of their fascination with violence and the human condition. Genre or no genre, this is why Marty’s films matter.
Some critics and online movie fans have argued that the problem with Gangs of New York is that the wrong story was told. Instead of focusing on Amsterdam getting revenge on Bill the Butcher, a lot of people wished Scorsese had focused on the relationship between Neeson’s Priest and Bill, in the years leading up Bill finally killing the Priest. I can see their point. Though who knows how good the story between Amsterdam and Bill could have been? As it exists, Gangs of New York feels like a great deal of relevant, interesting subplot was edited out of it, leaving it too short and incomplete (even at 167 minutes).
Gangs of New York has always felt to me like Scorsese’s Once Upon a Time in America. When it was cut up, it was rendered inferior to what it could/should have been. Guess we’ll have to wait to see what Scorsese’s original vision was in the upcoming years.
I think people miss a lot of the irony in The Aviator. It’s a very dark film and not obvious Oscar bait at all. It’s a fairly conventional (but well-crafted) script that’s executed with tremendous insight, subtlety, and perceptiveness by Scorsese. Also, it has one of the most depressing endings of any best picture nominee I can think of. And I’m not talking about the court case/plane flight (obviously), I’m talking about the breakdown/”way of the future” scene. To say it doesn’t have a soul is a gigantic admission of emotional stupidity. The film is overflowing with soul and really massive themes/ideas.
Such breathless hyperbole in the service of your master, JD. Shame it won’t work. You could always try hypnotism!
Personally, I found Million Dollar Baby and The Aviator to both be highly problematic. But I will take another look at The Aviator based on JD’s comments.
As for Clint Eastwood, he truly was one of the great American filmmakers from the late 80s to the early to mid-90s, but I find he hasn’t made an out and out good movie for years. As a friend pointed out to me, for a time his movies felt like satisfying tv episodes (Blood Work, True Crime), and then he decided to get serious, which is when the real problems began. Antonia Quirke’s review of Mystic River sums its problems up better than anything I’ve read on the film:
“There√ɬØ√Ǭø√ǬΩs something flaccidly neutral to Mystic River √ɬØ√Ǭø√Ç¬Ω not a whiff of eccentricity behind the camera, or proper yearning in the conversations, no sense that the corruption the story describes could infect us all, no heart-thwopping moment that makes one feel this is the truth and leave the cinema feeling your pain brought to the surface. Mystic River a well-made, manly, engagingly ensemble film. But it is about sadness, and feels impervious to grief.”
I liked the first half of Million Dollar Baby better than its second half, but it outright falls apart in its 3rd act. Eastwood’s agenda during the final half hour is so heavyhanded, it’s like he’s still being influenced by tv, but now it’s a moral “message” movie off of the Hallmark Channel. From Maggie’s family being reduced to absolutes (selfish, unfeeling, hardcore rednecks), to the euthanasia conclusion, I felt like I wasn’t being invited to get further emotionally involved in the story, but rather I was being manipulated through feeling to agree with the agendas being presented onscreen.
Sorry about the Quirke comments screwing up. Fixed they read:
“There’s something flaccidly neutral to Mystic River – not a whiff of eccentricity behind the camera, or proper yearning in the conversations, no sense that the corruption the story describes could infect us all, no heart-thwopping moment that makes one feel this is the truth and leave the cinema feeling your pain brought to the surface. Mystic River a well-made, manly, engagingly ensemble film. But it is about sadness, and feels impervious to grief.”
It is ironic that Marty’s movie lost to an anti-boxing movie directed by an actor turned director, 24 years after his boxing movie lost the to another movie directed by and actor turned director… not only ironic, but also kind of sad… I’m not saying The Aviator should’ve won, it shouldn’t, the most recent best picture winners (from the last 10-12 years, with the exception of American Beauty, maybe…) and nominees, are proof that the voters are too f*cking old to vote! and that Hollywood should pay a lot more atention to foreign films (foreign films meaning movies that are actually spoken in a foreign language!!!), everybody knows the Academy awards are about $$$: the ones who√Ǭ¥ve made more money, the ones that need to make more money… but, since the audiences have been going downhill, I don’t think their tactics are working very well… maybe it’s time for a change that’s all I’m saying… Oh, and I totally understand where Christopher Doyle is coming from, he may be a bit out there, but he’s absolutely right, and he says these things like a man who really cares about another man, and can’t just stand there and see his friend/person-who-he-deeply-admires f*ck up like that!
My biggest dream for Scorsese is to see him say “to hell with all this big budget studio nonsense”, grab a 16mm camera and film something lean and gritty on the streets of NYC. All the stars who proclaim they’d bend over backwards to work with The Master can work for scale just to be part of this guerilla film experience. People will be buzzing about it to a degree Marty’s last few films have lacked . . .
Of course, it’ll never happen. Pity.
Memo to Marty,
A director is only as good as his/her screenwriter. Perhaps it’s time to hook back up with the incomparable Paul Schrader.
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