comment #1

jeffmcm says ...

God, you're an asshole.

comment #2

Lloyd Dobler says ...

How does someone not enjoy A Christmas Story even on a basic entertainment level.

I sometimes get confused how u despise all these films but think a POS like Miami Vice is good.

comment #3

jeffmcm says ...

This article, shortened: "A filmmaker died in a traffic accident, but I'm glad he's dead because his movies weren't hip, and it was his own fault anyway for being out late."

comment #4

Noah says ...

The lesson is to not drive at that hour? How about the lesson is: don't drink and drive.

And man, I mean wait a little bit before bashing the guy's work. Maybe the guy wasn't Hitchcock, but he made a few films that brought a smile to my face (A Christmas Story, and hell I liked Turk 182!) and he made the original Black Christmas which is good for a few scares. It would be nice if Wells could at least pretend to give the guy a compliment after a horrible tragedy like this. But, whatever, I've given up trying to tell him how to act like a human being.

comment #5

gruver1 says ...

Wells to jeffmcm: Sorry, but Clark was what and who he was, and if you want cottonball kissy-face obits you know where to find them. A mediocre-to-bad director doesn't suddenly become a gifted boon to the industry that paid him millions of dollars for 30-plus years because he died in a sudden, brutal, horrible way. A terrible thing, but work-wise Clark was about as far away and as diametrically opposed to the art and brush-strokes of Jacques Tati or Stanley Kubrick or Ernst Lubitsch or Preston Sturges as anyone could get.

comment #6

lesterg says ...

Wow... I'm not going to defend the bulk of Clark's filmography either, but the guy's body hasn't even left the morgue yet.

comment #7

Wrecktum says ...

I agree that A Christmas Story is vastly overrated (a grim, sordid, cheap little film) but good lord man, have some respect.

comment #8

bmcintire says ...

Granted, I've gotten a little tired of A CHRISTMAS STORY, but Jeff, honestly. . . The guy had a pretty decent run in the 70's (BREAKING POINT, MURDER BY DECREE, BLACK CHRISTMAS) and I'm sure my fond memories of CHILDREN SHOULDN'T PLAY WITH DEAD THINGS are unwarranted, but the post above was uncalled for. Let's hope your sons fare better - like at least until after your body has been released by the CHP - before they're faced with similar vitriol. Because given your track record with the dead, you've got it coming.

comment #9

Lloyd Dobler says ...

This article, shortened:

"A filmmaker died in a traffic accident, but I'm glad he's dead because his movies weren't hip, and it was his own fault anyway for being out late. On a sidenote...are all my readers aware how hip I am? I mean I ride a motorcycle for godsake, and I'm like 60 years old! How do I pull this off?

I'm...Just...That...Cool.

And when I talk about riding it I make it sound even hipper than it actually is. God I'm awesome.

P.S. What is with all these people going to movies that I think are bad and will lead to the destruction of civilization as we know it?
Don't you guys realize that you are complete morons and utterly pathetic? Your probably the same people who don't vote for the people I vote for because your to stupid to realize that I'm smarter than you. I feel sorry for you people.

P.S.S. Did I mention I ride a motorcycle? Pretty cool...huh?"

comment #10

Noah says ...

Not every filmmaker aims to be Stanley Kubrick or Jacques Tati. Some filmmakers just want to make people smile. Just like not every journalist wants to be Nicholas D. Kristof. Some are content to be Jeffrey Wells.

comment #11

Lloyd Dobler says ...

50 years from now...during X-mas...people will still be watching A Christmas Story.

comment #12

JB Moore says ...

Wells, don't you have any guilty pleasures? Can't you eulogize the guy without snarkily critiquing his body of work and place in filmdom? These movies are minor classics amongst guys like me who came of age in the 80s with pay-cable. The "Porkys" movies were great, light T&A romps. "Rhinestone" is a cult classic amongst some of my friends (and yes they're film literate). Not to mention, give me "A Christmas Story" over the sappy "It's A Wonderful Life" any day (God bless TNT for running it 24hrs on 12/25). That movie is a classic. I never understood your hatred of it. So the guy wasn't Fellini, or Bergman. He made some good, light entertainment in his day. Oh well, RIP Mr. Clark and son, thanks for the fun movies and may that drunk SOB never see freedom again. Sad.

comment #13

Breedlove says ...

I don't have a problem with this post, and past ones like it, like everyone else seems to. When someone dies, it's an appropriate time to consider their life, their career, their accomplishments. I'm interested in Jeff's take on any and all filmmakers and Bob Clarke was never, ever going to be mentioned on this site unless he died. I appreciate the honesty and I think it's done in a respectful manner. Where you started to lose me, Jeff, is when you said that people shouldn't drive late at night because that's when the drunks are out, and "let this be a lesson." That's a bit much. As if the guy was doing something wrong for driving late at night.

comment #14

jeffmcm says ...

Jeffmcm to Wells: It obviously gives you vast satisfaction to be the 'straight-shooter' amidst all the other writers out there, but the truth of the matter is that it merely reveals you to be cold, opportunistic, and superficial. I'm all for contrarianism but there's a time and a place for everything and the occasion of the sudden deaths of two people is not the time to state boldly how superior your taste is.

Let's go ahead and write your obit: "Jeffrey Wells died today, crushed by falling rocks on his motorcycle. Obviously it's said whenever anybody dies suddenly, but let's face it: he had a failed marriage and he gave his kids funny names, and mostly sat around ranting and raving about how much hipper he was to anyone who would listen. A terrible thing, but compared to such influential movie writers as James Agee, Pauline Kael, Roger Ebert, Wells was a toad in a swamp."

comment #15

Earl Hofert says ...

Hold on, kids. I think this is just another example of the drier-than-dry sense of humor that Jeff was boasting about earlier today.

Either that or he is just being a douchebag again.

(For the record, I have never been the hugest fan of "A Christmas Story"--though the department store Santa sequence is aces--or much of Clark's other films but I will be more than happy to give a shout-out to "Black Christmas")

comment #16

ASD says ...

Can someone please point me in the direction of the sign-up sheet? I want to get in line now for pissing on Jeff Wells' grave.

Well put Jeffmcm but you forgot to mention "house-sitter to the semi-famous."

comment #17

Movie fan09 says ...

I'm kinda in agreement with jeff.
i hated A Christmas Story, and didn't watch for too long when it was on last december.

then I read a snippet from the book and liked it better.

I'm glad someone had the balls to be truthful.
I remember when Ronald Regan died, everyone was like "he was a great american," and I was like..
"didn't he sell nukes to terrorists?"

comment #18

George Prager says ...

He did make the amazing Death Dream
http://imdb.com/title/tt0068457/

a lost classic about a undead soldier returning from Vietnam. really creepy.

from allmovie.com
This dark, brooding low-budget effort opens in Vietnam, where young infantryman Andy Brooks (Richard Backus) is struck down by a sniper's bullet. At the same time in Andy's hometown, his poor mother is uttering a desperate prayer for Andy to come home... and shortly thereafter, he does. Despite Mrs. Brooks' exultation at her son's safe return, it becomes apparent to the rest of the family that there's something terribly wrong with Andy; he won't do much more than sit in a chair, staring blankly at the walls of his room... that is, until nightfall, when he prowls the town in search of human blood, which he extracts from his victims through a syringe and injects into his own veins. The first horror effort from director Bob Clark, who followed with Children Shouldn't Play with Dead Things! and the effective thriller Black Christmas, this haunting film (released as The Veteran in 1972) functions as a Vietnam-era variant on the classic story of "The Monkey's Paw" and was one of the first films of the genre to address the stateside reactions to the horrors of that war.

comment #19

bostonlackey says ...

Breedlove -

That is perhaps the single greatest post I've ever seen in a talkback. I was shaking with laughter.

Jeff's entitled to his opinions and yes, he's guilty of insensitivity here given the timing, but I think what we're witnessing is the encroachment of simple old-age bitterness. There is such contempt seething in his words and I've been following them since his days at Mr. Showbiz. I'm frankly shocked at the outright instances of bigotry and anger in his writing but I'm drawn to them as some kind of social experiment.

Most fascinating of all is he seems complete oblivious to the change.

Rest in peace, Bob Clark and son Ariel.

comment #20

swanson67 says ...

I actually agree with Wells. He did say the event was tragic, but let's face it: The guy's movies sucked.

comment #21

JD says ...

There's a big difference between a straight-shooter and an ignorant one. Fine, you didn't like A Christmas Story -- you may be the only one -- but there's no doubt that Bob Clark was the Canadian George A. Romero. Without Black Christmas (one of the first and best slasher films), there would be no Halloween. And Deathdream is an incredibly powerful parable about the lasting effects of war. Anyone who hasn't seen it should track it down immediately. Turk 182, Children Shouldn't Play With Dead Things, and Murder By Decree are also totally respectable (never been a fan of Porky's, though). Jeff, we all know you don't like/understand horror cinema, but what's the sense in belittling every single horror filmmaker individually when a simple blanket dismissal of the genre would suffice. And your cynical "respect and compassion are for sissies" philosophy was tiresome years ago.

comment #22

bmcintire says ...

Oh, I don't know, Breedlove. I'm sure that had Clarke's remake of CHILDREN SHOULDN'T PLAY WITH DEAD THINGS (slated for a 2006 release - what happened there?) ever come to fruition, Jeff would have taken every opportunity available to piss on it and all of the man's "coarse, unsubtle and grossly commercial" work. And I think Jeff crushing the period of "when a person dies" down to the 13-hour-mark of the DOA prononcement pretty much defines coarse, unsubtle and gross.

comment #23

bostonlackey says ...

Breedlove -

That is perhaps the single greatest post I've ever seen in a talkback. I was shaking with laughter.

Jeff's entitled to his opinions and yes, he's guilty of insensitivity here given the timing, but I think what we're witnessing is the encroachment of simple old-age bitterness. There is such contempt seething in his words and I've been following them since his days at Mr. Showbiz. I'm frankly shocked at the outright instances of bigotry and anger in his writing but I'm drawn to them as some kind of social experiment.

Most fascinating of all is he seems complete oblivious to the change.

Rest in peace, Bob Clark and son Ariel.

comment #24

swanson67 says ...

i actually agree with Wells on this. His movies sucked.

comment #25

Noah says ...

Yeah, Alfred, except Bob Clark didn't sell nukes to terrorists. He simply made a few movies that el jefe didn't find agreeable. Then Jeff had the temerity to make it seem like it was the dude's fault for being hit by a drunk driver. Ronald Reagan, president of the US and Bob Clark, director are not comparable.

comment #26

tholl-yung says ...

Woah, let's take in the groovy artwork for a moment.

comment #27

Craig Kennedy says ...

I'm torn between being in absolute agreement over Wells' opinion, but horrified by his timing.

I'm all for being honest and not pulling punches, but did it occur to you Jeff to just not say anything at all?

Life is rough and most people get kicked around pretty good before it's all over so I think if at no other time, the day a man dies should be a day of respect...or at the very least dignified silence.

I mean come on, say what you want about Porky's, the guy wasn't Hitler or Ted Bundy or anything.

comment #28

swanson67 says ...

The timing isnt great, but at least Wells is honest! Seriously, I hate all the fake seniment that ensues when someone dies. For once, Wells is right!

comment #29

jeffmcm says ...

Let's make this clear: this article consists of two paragraphs about "Clark is dead and here's how it happened" and three paragraphs about "why Clark was a shitty director". And one perplexing "don't drive around at 2 in the morning on the PCH".

It's not the basic sentiment that I find offensive: it's the excessiveness. Wells could have made his point in one short line "I didn't like any of his movies, but it's still tragic."

comment #30

swanson67 says ...

I agree with T.Holly. Where did that come from??

comment #31

bmcintire says ...

I'm guessing the pics are Jeff's attempt at pre- and post-mortem portraiture. Extra-classy. Of course, he's laughing with blind greed-tinged glee as the clicks keep racking up on this one.

comment #32

Hallick says ...

"Nava and his passenger, Lydia Mora, 29, were treated for minor injuries and later released...Don't drink and drive, obviously, but don't drive when the assholes who do this anyway are out in force."

But if you must drive during those hours, then by all means, DRIVE DRUNK. Because you'll always walk away from these murders completely unharmed.

Honestly, if I were in the mood to build a case against God and the idea of divine intervention, the reality that drunks pretty much ALWAYS stumble away unharmed while some poor bastards like the Clarks are getting wheeled to the morgue would probably be Exibit A. I usually loathe the idea of police brutality, but in cases like this one (assuming he's 100% guilty) I wish they'd beat Nava's testicles into compote.

Actually, justice would be burying this guy alive with his victims.

comment #33

jimjonesiii says ...

you guys need to start facing death as a positive thing.
sure, sometimes you just leave, randomly (we think), without being able to say goodbye to your loved ones- but hey, that´s part of life.
not death.
having said that, clark´s filmography was super shitty.
i liked turk 182 as a kid though.

comment #34

Movie fan09 says ...

Noah:
ehh.

maybe Jeff is getting bitter.
if so-jeff-film something.
you may not get it exhibited..but at least it's out there.

comment #35

tholl-yung says ...

The art's the really mournful part. Jeff put some time into it, that's lovely. There's no way he lifted it.

comment #36

Mcflyboy says ...

Jeffmcm, your Wells obit was too funny. Don't forget his notoriously dry sense of humor. it all makes me question why I still read his site. Wells has been in douchebag mode for a while now. He's so out of touch and it's just sad.

comment #37

Dan Revill says ...

Lloyd, you forgot to add that in 50 years no one will remember this website.

A Christmas Story, for being overplayed, is still classic.

comment #38

Walter Sobchak says ...

I didn't read the full report on the accident but was Bob Clark over-weight as well? I'm with you, Wells. Good riddance!

comment #39

ben151 says ...

To the unitiated, filmmaker Bob Clark writes and directs a kind of movie anti-matter. But he’s also an improbable, accidental auteur who defined the genre film in three massive genres: slasher horror, teen sex comedy, and sentimental holiday nostalgia.

“Black Christmas,” which appeared four years before the John Carpenter classic “Halloween,” impressed Akira Kurasawa so much Clark claim Kurasawa asked Clark to work with him on an early version of “Ran.”

“Deathdream,” an early anti-Vietnam War horror film, was at one point being remade by Eli Roth.

Clark had a cracker upbringing. He turned down pro football offers (he was a Miami Hurricane standout) to go into the movies. He got his start as the makeup artist on the 1961 British farce “Why Bother to Knock” before moving on to make low budget exploitation flicks in Ft. Myers, Florida, for a man who had a “combination indoor tomato plant, storage house, and movie studio” and in Lehigh Acres, Florida, a junglified Everglades community where he collaborated with a funeral parlor owner and his family to make “The She-Man,” the first movie about a transvestite spy. He was also the assistant director of “Shanty Tramp,” a 1967 sleaze classic that was distributed outside the studio system by the mercenary impresario Kroger Babb.

He claimed David Mamet, Norman Mailer, and Arthur Miller as fans.

RIP.

comment #40

gruver1 says ...

Wells to Mcflyboy: And I would be more in touch if I thought Clark's movies were good, which no one with a smidgen of taste ever did (with the possible exception of "A Christmas Story")?

Wells to swanson67: Thanks for the support.

comment #41

MASON says ...

I love ya, Wells. Big fan of the site. But man, it's like you only posted this story to trash another filmmaker you didn't like -- on the day he and his son died tragically. Wow. Just wow.

comment #42

jeffmcm says ...

Wells (and Swanson): What 'fake sentiment'? There wasn't even time for an obit to run when you wrote yours. You're exercising a policy of preemptive contrarianism. It can't even be called a useful corrective because the only thing you were reacting to was the man's death.

comment #43

JD says ...

"And I would be more in touch if I thought Clark's movies were good, which no one with a smidgen of taste ever did (with the possible exception of "A Christmas Story")?"

This is precisely why you're out of touch, Jeff. You suffer from that pre-Pauline Kael delusion that a movie is its subject matter and nothing else. Therefore, all horror films represent bad taste and all Merchant-Ivory films represent good taste. Worthwhile cinema knows no genre boundaries. Get a clue and/or take 90 minutes and watch Deathdream.

comment #44

Noah says ...

This is not a matter of being "in touch" or not. It's a matter of decency. Like I said earlier, the man was no Hitchcock, but this is not the time to point out his flaws. This man was not Osama bin Laden, he was a film director. Save your bitterness for a day or two.

comment #45

p.Vice says ...

Let me just say I'm thrilled to annouce that, for once, Jeffrey and I are in complete agreement!!! FUCK BOB CLARK!!!! The guy made shitty movies that are an affront to the word "intelligence". Black Christmas? Christmas Story? Porky's? You have to be fucking kidding me. This outpouring of sympathy is worse than when everyone choked back tears when Pat Morita croaked a few years ago.

If you think this is "tragic", look up Darfur on a map, motherfuckers. Try reading a book about the genocide that happens on a daily basis around the world next Christmas instead of watching the 24-hour Christmas Story marathon on TNT. Think about how many poor people in the world continue to get fucked over and killed while you're busy expressing your "sympathy" over Clark's death. This river of tears, and even the anger towards Jeffrey's thoughts, explains why the world has gone completely to hell -- 99 out of 100 people think that middling, meaningless celebrity is far more important than anything a person gives back to the world. The only reason anyone even cares about this ugly bastard is because they watched Christmas Story when they were a kid. If Clark spent his life running a printing press for whatever company makes info pamphlets for, say, Planned Parenthood, his life would have been more commendable than it is now. But no, because he spent his life entertaining the dumbest of the dumb, this somehow becomes sad, sad, horrible news.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled mindless entertainment on Hollywood Elsewhere!!!

comment #46

Mr. Muckle says ...

There were two parts to JW's article. One was his comments on the accident and regretable death. His statements were entirely appropriate, it seems to me. The second part, since this site is about movies and the biz, is a brief placing of the deceased within the industry. That also is on topic and basically correct.

I don't understand the seeming knee-jerk negativity to Jeff Wells in the comments about nearly every post. If you guys are so outraged and superior, why not go somewhere else?

Otherwise you're just slumming, by your own admission, and not that clever. Or you could knock off the reactionary bullshit and try to contribute something the rest of us might find worth reading. You can always host your own blog if you think you'd get a couple of readers.

comment #47

Noah says ...

p. Vice

This is a movie website. Obviously what's happening in Darfur is upsetting, but it has nothing to do with what we're talking about. Just because there are terrible things going on in Africa doesn't mean that a senseless death is any less upsetting. Especially the senseless death of somebody who is in the industry which we all have a passion for.

comment #48

Noah says ...

Mr. Muckle,

It's not a knee-jerk thing. When Jeff writes something that I agree with, then I'll say so. But if we're not to give our opinions, then what is the point of this message board at all? Are we supposed to just worship at the altar of El Jefe or give our honest reactions to what Jeff has written?

comment #49

rocco says ...

I'm tired of this shit...Jeff, you are a despicable human being...my voice is just lost in the crowd, but for what it's worth, you are a loathsome, curmudgeonly fuck.

Your writing exhibits no restraint. Some people love the candor, but this has become a fucking passion of yours...Jeff Wells must be known as the straight shooter. Someone dies and we should all look to the eminent Jeffrey Wells for the straight dope. No one says poor on the saccharin, but get the fuck over yourself.

Hollywood Elsewhere is NOTHING MORE than a 'Porkys' or a 'Christmas Story'...and in the sense that those movies were sincere--that they knew their station--you are worse. H-e is an online gossip rag sprinkled with insider info and an occasional insightful hiccup...a big greasy knish...telling it like it doesn't lend you any legitimacy. Getting mentioned in Variety for comment-sections squabbles doesn't either. I come here (more specifically, I come to your comment section) for the same reasons I eat McDonalds fries...it's just fucking tasty...the difference is that I don't have to listen to the assistant GM at the local Mickey D's pontificate and proselytize about the superiority of his establishment.

I wish I knew how to quit you, because at this moment I'm ashamed of my association with this site. Jeffmcm's obit was fucking brilliant. Let that be a wakeup call...

comment #50

jeffmcm says ...

P Vice, not a single person has expressed undue sorrow about Clark's death. What 'outpouring of sympathy'? The point is that Wells thinks it's a good idea to jump on his still-warm corpse in order to prove how clever and hip he is. The reason the world is going to hell is because people like Wells think it's more important to look cool and on top of things than it is to allow any decent period of reflection. It's selfish and petty and I refuse to let him get away with it.

comment #51

christian says ...

bob clark directed some of the best genre films of the 70's, and BLACK CHRISTMAS is still just a balls to the wall scary fucking film. and as much as i despised PORKY'S, i adore CHRISTMAS STORY as it veers from the smartass to the sentimental with out being cloying. and it features darren mcgavin. if a filmmaker can make even one film that somehow endures, well, that's okay.

RIP. this sucks. but it's bad form to slag somebody that way.

comment #52

Lloyd Dobler says ...

I think people are more and more annoyed with how much of elitist left wing moron/snob Wells is turning out to be. He also seems to think that his opinion is the real opinion(not just his personal view but the TRUTH) on things like what movies are supposed to be about, what defines a worthy film/filmmaker/etc, what is hip and what isn't, what is right what is wrong etc etc. Anyone else who doesn't understand how plainly obvious this is, in his book, is either mentally retarded or from the midwest.

Once you realize that Jeff is essentially a tool, but a loveable and funny one...though annoying(kind of like that crazy relative that shows up for the holidays every year) then you can kind of just laugh at his statments and enjoy his column for what it is.

Love the column Jeff.

comment #53

alynch says ...

Jesus fucking Christ! I read the first paragraph on the main page and assume that this will be a respectful article about the tragedy of a filmmaker's life cut short by a drunken driver, and as I read it I became more and more revolted.

When you write an article about someone's tragic death, talking about how he sucked at his job shouldn't be the main theme of it.

comment #54

IClavdivs says ...

Are we sure this is the same Jeff Wells because there seems to be something wrong with him these days.

comment #55

Mike Binder says ...

I am so going to get ass-raped by Wells and all the rest of you yud-yuds (and yes, pudheads) the minute I die. Wow. The internet is so cool. I love it!

comment #56

bmcintire says ...

Anyone care to pile on the hurt for Clarke's son? I mean, he was the progeny of an apparent worthless piece of shit.
And p.Vice, your anonymity makes me sad in that we will be robbed of the opportunity to shoot "Save Darfur" wristbands at your still steaming corpse once you die.

comment #57

Noah says ...

Mr. Binder, I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not (sarcasm doesn't translate well on the web) but I think the internet is pretty cool. Now, journalists can't just write something and feed it to the public. Now the public has a chance to inform the journalist as much as the journalist informs the reader. It's more symbiotic now than it has been in the past and I think if you listened to some of these "pudheads" that visit this site, you might be surprised at some of the arguments they make. Cheers.

comment #58

James says ...

I'm ashamed right now to be an HE reader. Not because of Jeff's post. But because such a large percentage of other HE readers seem to be such self-righteous, holier-than-thou losers. This thread is for me like an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm, in which Larry (i.e. Jeff) says something almost everyone is thinking, then gets slammed by everyone for saying it. In this case, the slamming has become so self-serving and insincere that we get lectures on journalistic ethics, taste, and human decency. Give me a break!

And yes, I'm talking about you, Noah, jeffmcm and dellbomber. I wish you guys would post less. I really do. I hate having to wade through the likes of you to find someone actually addressing the CONTENT of what Jeff has written, rather than psycho-analyizing him, giving him career advice, or otherwise commenting upon what sort of person he is. THIS IS A WEBSITE ABOUT MOVIES. JEFF IS WRITING ABOUT MOVIES--NOT PROVIDING FODDER FOR YOU TO HOLD COURT ABOUT YOUR PEA-BRAINED NOTIONS OF RIGHT AND WRONG!!!

And I, for one, would like to return to the conversation.

comment #59

jeffmcm says ...

If HE is full of self-righteous holier-than-thou types it's because the tones was set long ago by Wells, the king of them all.

You want me to address the content of the post? I think that's exactly what I did. You want me to restrict myself to the proposition "Bob Clark: Hollywood scumbag or decent guy"? Fine: I disagree because I love A Christmas Story and I like Black Christmas and Porky's. But to accept those terms of debate (the CONTENT of what Jeff has written) is to admit defeat in the larger argument over whether his overall comments were appropriate or not. That is the fucking conversation, sorry if it hurts your feelings.

comment #60

tholl-yung says ...

that's beautiful James

comment #61

James says ...

By the way, I'd like to give a shout out to jcal, ben151 and JD for actually addressing the content of Jeff's post and letting me in an some info about Clark I didn't know before. Interesting stuff. Sure, JD got all self-righteous also, but at least he was being self-righteous about taste in movies.

jeffmcm, with your rapid fire posting, you are bullying the conversation into what YOU want it to be about. But of course, you and your ilk can can debate the finer points of blog etiquette if you want--nothing I can do to stop you. But I, for one, would prefer to be part of a conversation about MOVIES that includes the interesting and on-point opinions of jcal, ben151, and JD.

comment #62

Noah says ...

James, now you're writing about blog etiquette. I think we were talking about movies and debating what Jeff wrote. You disagree, that's fine, but you don't have to make it into a war of some kind, taking sides and whatnot. We're all here to talk about movies and argue about them.

comment #63

jeffmcm says ...

James, I don't see how my postings are substantively different from anything that was posted by the three people you mention, especially when they say "your cynical 'respect and compassion are for sissies' philosophy was tiresome years ago." or "This is precisely why you're out of touch, Jeff."

By agreeing to Wells's terms of discussion, one is intrinsically agreeing with his notion that it's acceptable to shit on a person at the instant that their death flashes out over the AP wire. You are aware that he does this _every time_ a famous death occurs, right? "Telling it like it is" is his M.O.

I wish I knew what was worse: the idea that it's all part of a clever, cynical scheme to drum up site traffic, or the idea that he's expressing these thoughts independently of commercial considerations.

comment #64

travis b says ...

so, jeffmcm, if you're worried about all this being for site traffic, why bother helping with that?

comment #65

slothroplt says ...

You know, I like your site Wells but why rip a guy on the same day he's knocked down -- oh, i'm sorry...KILLED.

Piling on right now -- right now -- is just crass. In fact, it's fucking disgusting.

He was a commercial hack. So what? He's dead. Dead, man. DEAD. He and his kid.

DEAD.

Asshole.

.

.

.

...and not liking "A Christmas Story"? What the fuck is up with that?

comment #66

rocco says ...

This is a website about movies? Not even ostensibly...Keith Richards news? An obsession with the McGowan-Rodriguez affair? The political and environmental lemming postings...I wish this site was about movies...it used to be...and if that makes me sentimental, well color me Martin Scorsese...

Calling out a man for desecrating another man is not holier than thou, it's decency. Jeff didn't just pick off the guy's movies--which would have been a bit hasty but entirely defensible--he expressed a deep disdain and contempt for the man himself...a man whose work is on the same plane of cultural insignificance as this very blog and blogger...neither qualify as art, they are consumptive entertainment...linking to other people's stories and ranting about the state of brainless comedies is not what the French call joie de vivre...Jeff gave up art for commercialism a long time ago...you want to talk about holier than thou? That's the very definition.

comment #67

sandekat says ...

'I wish I knew what was worse: the idea that it's all part of a clever, cynical scheme to drum up site traffic, or the idea that he's expressing these thoughts independently of commercial considerations.'

Jeff woke up one day and realized that he was well back in the pack and that he had lost sight of the leaders. I presume that's when he decided to tap into his inner jerk. His writing is neither elegant nor insightful, so he has settled for arrogant provocation. But his flop sweat is showing and his rancor is tiresome. You can only watch the lunatic on the soapbox spewing for so long before the spectacle grows tiresome.

I just hope that no one from this gentleman's family strumbles upon this 'obituary'. That would be horribly sad.

James, life (and death) trumps movies every time.

comment #68

MoisesChiu says ...

Again, comments equal wild misinterpretation.

The "lesson learned" bit referenced by a bunch of jerks (just as big of ones as Jeff) above was not intended as a "shoulda known better, asshole" or "lissen here, young bucks". Jeff's comment was more directed as a word of caution.

As for it being "too soon!" for criticizing his body of work, how fast would you comment addict jokers jump all over a dead Joel Schumacher, or Roland Emmerich? Adam Shankman?

comment #69

Leonardcoenbrothers says ...

P Vice, I'm sitting here trying to decide who is the bigger asshole, you or wells....hmmmm....I think its a tie.

comment #70

messiahcomplexio says ...

I wonder if Clark was secretly having an affair with Robert Rodriquez wife when this accident occurred? Sounds like a story for you Jeff! Get on it!!

comment #71

Noah says ...

Moises,

I don't think it would be that hard to come up with something nice to say about the director of Stargate or ID4 (two movies that while they may not be masterpieces are certainly enjoyable genre fare) or the director of Falling Down, Tigerland and The Lost Boys (a film I loved as a kid). Adam Shankman, I mean I'm not terrible familiar with his work but on IMDB it said he was the choreographer of Boogie Nights and directed a few episodes of the great show Monk, so I think I could probably come up with something nice to say.

I get your point, that there are directors who are not the greatest. But as my mother taught me, if you don't have something nice to say (especially about the recently deceased), then just write that he passed away and move along.

comment #72

rocco says ...

I'm expressing no sympathy for Clarke...100,000 other people died yesterday and no one but a few family members shed a tear...

...there's nothing insincere about what I've written...dancing on someone's grave whose worst crime was making commercial movies while running a fucking knish of site yourself is deserving of criticism.

Moises, don't throw hypothetical darts...it does nothing to flatter your intellect. Defend your traffic director's grave dancing straightforwardly or stay out of it.

comment #73

travis b says ...

you guys are funny. no one here even mentions how someone out there just lost their 22 year old son or brother or their father. nor does anyone give any condolences (well, except for mr. wells)...or how fucked up it is that people drink and drive all the fucking time. instead, you sit here and rip on someone because of their opinion. constantly. jeffmcm, i'm calling you out specifically. you post on here more times than wells does, constantly sniping without bringing anything to the table, and for what? attention? you don't like the opinions stated here (and guess what..they are just opinions), then do something else. if anything, the sad passing of Mr. Clarke shows that life is too short. why spend time reading something you quite obviously don't care for? get out and do something. it all comes and goes too fast.

comment #74

Geoff says ...

I haven't eve read the majority of the posts here. But those of you who don't like A Christmas Story or don't respect Clark for Black Christmas can FUCK OFF.

comment #75

jeffmcm says ...

I'm sorry, calling me out for what, exactly? Having an opinion? Being bored by work and seeing that The Hot Blog has been boring lately?

By all means, please let me know how to remedy whatever situation you are referring to, Travis B.

comment #76

travis b says ...

being bored at work is one thing. but posting nine times on one story..and only in different variations of how wells is an asshole is a pretty big waste of time. you don't like it, fine, you said your piece (again, nine times without ever saying anything remotely interesting or different than what you succintly said in your first post of "god you're an asshole"), we get the point, now move on. it's all just needless sniping. if you're that bored, then might i suggest find a new job..? i think that would be a remedy we all would appreciate.

comment #77

CharlieDontSurf says ...

This blog is 90% about Jeff and his ego and 10% about movies. Jeff hates with such passion a majority of the film industry that it is amazing he continues to attempt to maintain a living working on the fringes of it.

comment #78

CharlieDontSurf says ...

Director Bob Clark, who helmed the modern holiday classic A Christmas Story and was the writer-director-producer of the Porky's films, died in a car crash with his son on the Pacific Coast Highway early Wednesday morning; he was 67. The director of the 1974 cult horror film Black Christmas as well as the 1980 Jack Lemmon drama Tribute (which nabbed Lemmon a Best Actor Oscar nomination), Clark scored a major box office success in the early '80s with the teen sex comedy Porky's, a surprise hit that he wrote, directed and produced which became the highest-grossing film of 1982 and one of the highest-grossing films ever in Canada. Clark went on to helm the sequel, Porky's II: The Next Day, a year later, but it was another 1983 film that would become his most memorable. Based on humorist Jean Shepherd's short story collection In God We Trust, All Others Pay Cash, A Christmas Story was the nostalgic and humorous tale of a young boy named Ralphie (Peter Billingsley) growing up in the 1940s who yearned for the ultimate Christmas gift, a Red Ryder BB gun. Also starring Darren McGavin and Melinda Dillon, the comedy (which Clark directed, co-wrote and produced) was a modest success in its initial box office run but gained a strong and steady following through the next two decades, becoming a TV staple during the holiday season and a consistent seller on DVD. Clark's other films included the Dolly Parton-Sylvester Stallone comedy Rhinestone, Turk 182!, From the Hip, and the two Baby Geniuses movies. Recently, there had been talk of Howard Stern producing a remake of Porky's, and Clark had begun development on a remake of one of his first films, the horror movie Children Shouldn't Play With Dead Things.

So he

1. directed what is considered a modern xmas classic for many
2. Directed a film which netted his lead actor a Oscar nom.
3. Directed a cult horror classic
4. Directed a big box office success
5. Managed to continue to work for over 3 decades.

Seems like he had a pretty decent directing career to me.
Was a great artistic director? Nope.
Did he do brilliant work? Nope.
Did he have get farther than most. Yep.

Would Jeff ever have written about him and tried to show how much his tastes are superior to the masses by bashing his films unless he and his son had died. Nope

The problem with Jeff's whole argument besides its tone, is that Jeff is in the minority when he rants on A Christmas Story and the Porky movies.

Are they great films...no? No one ever claimed them to be anything other than mindless and enjoyable fun. Much the same as watching Home Alone during Xmas or Road House/American Pie/Road Trip/etc on late night cable. They are viewed as movies people enjoy...not Oscars or cutting edge art.

Jeff doesn't enjoy these movies apparantly or maybe he's just a bitter old cranky man, he hated 300, he hates Will Ferrell movies-he seems to hate the majority of movies now a days...oh, well he liked Miami Vice.

Whatever..but the majority of posters on here would kill to have any directing career at all...yes even McG's...let alone direct a cult classic and a box office success.

comment #79

MovieBob says ...

A man is DEAD. His son died beside him. Perhaps quickly, but not quietly and almost-certainly not painlessly. In all likelihood, the last words - if any- either of them spoke, to eachother and at all, were a mix of expletives and screams. Not "I love you." Not "goodbye." No glory, no justice, no greater picture to it, either: The beginning and end of the story is that an idiot drove drunk.

A man is DEAD.

My first reaction is to ask Mr. Wells if he approaches EVERY story that isn't about Michael Mann with the additude of "how can I come off like as HUGE a douchebag as possible?" But in a way I'm thankful, because HIS lack of tact in waiting the customer week-or-more to start bagging on a dead filmmaker who's work wasn't 100% flawless means that the business of DEFENDING Mr. Clark's filmography can be got about that much sooner.

Clark made a lot of movies. Most of them weren't very good. Some were awful. But THREE of them were outright, genre-redefining classics. "Christmas Story," "Black Christmas" and "Deathdream." And "Porky's" is kind of brilliant in it's own way. He was not Stanley Kubrick. He was not Alfred Hitchcock. But he mattered.

comment #80

Terry McCarty says ...

It's good that Jeffrey allows all kinds of opinions here on this blog--about his own posts and pros-and-cons regarding the posts of others (notably the George Hickenlooper thread).

Be thankful there's not knee-jerk censorship here to protect "sensitivities" or shield certain people from others' negative opinions.

Having said that, I'll guess that Bob Clark will be mentioned in future generations as the director of A CHRISTMAS STORY--and the rest of his filmography--both good and awful--forgotten.

comment #81

frankbooth says ...

The guy directed the two best Christmas movies ever made (I'm not counting Die Hard, which could just as well have been set on the 4th of July). Deathdream is also a cool little film, as I recall.

Check out how Clark used the constant, howling, winter wind to create tension in BC. I have no idea if Kubrick ever saw that movie, but it was made well before The Shining (which was just another crappy genre movie, right?)

As for the recent change in attitude, do the math, gang. Isn't someone near a very major birthday? Mortality's a bitch.

comment #82

joe dante says ...

Gosh, Jeff, I like your site and all, but I sure hope it's not active when I kick off!

comment #83

MoisesChiu says ...

I was more making the point that Jeff didn't like the guy's work and made that more than evident, but didn't go shouting "good riddance/who gives a fuck/fuck this fucking fucker" like it's being characterized. The moment Jeff said something negative about the guy's work, whether today or a year from now, it'd be "too soon" and the comments section would light up like George Hickenlooper and Mike Binder offered to tag team wrestle the two nastiest commenters on the site that day. Naked.

I agree with you on those directors, Noah, and I actually like those guys for a lot of the work you mention, illustrative of my point. I wasn't saying I think they're shit directors, but as many jerks as we have on here (myself included), we'd have just as many raving, rabid opinions no matter how much Jeff liked them.

The hate tossed on his admiration of Michael Mann above touches on this precisely. He could write up some glowing tribute to the guy and there would be reams of comments to the effect of "dude wasn't so fuckin good..."

Jeff isn't here to sell papers or magazine subscriptions, he's writing his take on stuff. You want something glowing about everybody who makes movies, call Larry King.

I seriously doubt anyone here agrees with Jeff all the time. Matter of fact, I find the people who most often and most vehemently argue with him beyond a clutch of return commenters, are the people who write on the damn site.

del, you've obviously been reading his stuff for a good long while, so Wells saying this stuff shouldn't come as a shock. Jeff writes these death notices up and adds his pov on the people as they struck him as artists. You wonder aloud to the huddled masses of the internet why you can't stop reading this thing you hate. You admit that you have a problem. That's the first step of overcoming your addiction. Godspeed.

In general, folks: OMIGOD SOME1 SAID IT ON TEH INTERNETS!!!1 OH NOES!!

comment #84

Noah says ...

Moises,

I think Jeff certainly did get a conversation going with his post and isn't that all why we come here? I think Jeff has his own issues and I have my opinions about him and this is where I share them. That's why the message board is here. I think Jeff is smart enough to know what he's doing and some of the best threads are the ones where we all disagree with how Jeff handled a situation or his POV on a movie or filmmaker. We don't all come here to worship him, we come here to argue with him and with each other.

I think you underestimate the posters on here if you think that we'd be sensitive to Jeff ever saying anything negative about Bob Clark. He just didn't have to do it mere hours after his untimely passing. Fuck, CNN didn't say a bad word about Anna Nicole Smith and treated her death like it was Princess Di. I think Jeff could've at least treated Bob Clark with the same amount of respect and restraint. I think we all could've figured how Jeff would've thought about the man's films.

We come here to talk about film and argue our points with one another. We will never all agree and I think Jeff knows that and I admire the fact that he trudges onwards despite name-calling and such. But, I believe that since he put this message board here, I can write down my belief that he was wrong in this situation and it is your right to disagree with me. Cheers.

comment #85

D.Z. says ...

Forget Clark and drunk-driving for a sec. I think this story should be an indictment of SUV drivers. I seriously hate those gas-guzzling behemoths, because
like dinosaurs, they're usually powered by small brains. They need to be banned or taxed or both.

comment #86

scooterzz says ...

i have a feeling that, when the details re: the 24 year old driver of the other vehicle come out, the direction of this thread might change....as well it should (even though it won't have anything to do with movies)....

comment #87

Patrick says ...

Jeffrey - Please check out 'Murder by Decree'
directed by Mr. Clark. It features one Christopher
Plummer's best film performances and a very strong
late-career effort from James Mason. It's the
best film from start-to-finish that Clark directed
in my opinion.

comment #88

jeffmcm says ...

Hey, is that the real Joe Dante? I'd like to say that I'm a big fan and thanks for making so many fun movies over the years - even Looney Tunes, which I know was tough for you but still came out very enjoyable. For me, anyway.

Keep up the good work.

Scooterzz, do you have some information the rest of us don't?

comment #89

Silverscreenvideos says ...

Bob Clark was a director who got his start in the Canadian film industry and was never given access to A-list material or actors. He had a tiny window of opportunity after Christmas Story but Sylvester Stallone and Turk 182 (which I actually like) pretty much killed that. The last two decades of his life couldn't have been very satisfying from a creative standpoint.

However, he has managed something that few other directors will ever do. He created a perennial classic, a movie that will be seen by millions every single year from now on. And that's something few directors have or will ever accomplish.

I for one think his best piece was Murder by Decree, maybe the best Sherlock Holmes movie ever made, but his 70's thrillers (especially the original Black Christmas) weren't bad and Porkys will live in cultdom forever.

In the last year or so, we've lost the two main artistic forces responsible for Christmas Story, Clark and Darren McGavin, and the film world is a lesser place for that.

So, rest in peace Bob Clark; you've earned it.

comment #90

Alan Cerny says ...

Wow, I didn't realize Clark did MURDER BY DECREE. That's a good movie.

And to those who hate PORKY'S... get a sense of fucking humor. It's way more honest than AMERICAN GRAFFITI or other films who want to sugarcoat their youth. Or did the penis suddenly appear in 1970? It ain't a Kurosawa or anything, but it's a lot of fun and compared to the dumb comedies of today it may as well be Harold fucking Pinter.

And A CHRISTMAS STORY needs nothing said from me. It doesn't matter if some here think it's overrated - the American public has decided. And I agree with them. It's a classic.

I think the first post, "God, you're an asshole," should have been the beginning and the end of this thread.

Fudge.

comment #91

Rich S. says ...

Funny, but having visited this site (as well as Jeff's other ones) for many years, the first thing I thought of when I heard about Clark's death was, "here comes the HE hatchet job."

Regardless of what you think of its merits as a "film," A Christmas Story has become part of the American lexicon, and, in my opinion, deservedly so. I suspect that one of the things that makes Jeff so cranky is that no matter what he does for the rest of his life, no matter how many blog posts he pumps out between now and shuffling off the mortal coil, no matter how many times he strokes Michael Mann or trashes Eddie Murphy, he will NEVER EVER produce something that means as much to so many people as A Christmas Story. Jeff must denigrate Bob Clark because, whether he is a "hack" or not, he is immortal, something Jeff can never be.

No one will write this kind of obituary of Jeffrey Wells because, sadly, no one will ever care that much. To paraphrase Oscar Wilde, the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference.

comment #92

bipedalist says ...

Nice one, Jeff McM.

comment #93

dixiedugan says ...

JeffMCM - "Velazquez-Nava was arrested Wednesday afternoon and booked for investigation of driving under the influence of alcohol and gross vehicular manslaughter. He was being held on $100,000 bail.

"The initial investigation has concluded that Nava was driving without a license northbound in the southbound lanes while under the influence of an alcoholic beverage," Vernon said.

The implication made last night when I was listening to the story that Nava is an illegal alien, so I take it that's what scooterzz was alluding to.

comment #94

The Hey says ...

Aside from "Xmas Story" he was not thought of as a very good director.

There are a good number of films that really truly sucked (Baby Geniuses 1 & 2, Loose Cannons), I did enjoy a lot of his other films like Turk 182, the first Porky's movie and It Runs in the Family, another film featuring Ralphie and his family written Jean Sheppard.

comment #95

christian says ...

i forgot about MURDER BY DECREE and TRIBUTE...

i doubt jeff has seen DEATHDREAM -- if he did he would be impressed by the care and scare of this vietnam horror metaphor, one of the few films of the 70's that dared to mention nam.

and nobody here has mentioned bob clark's signature moment -- where a character or characters laugh uncontrollably. it's pretty much in every single one of his movies and it always seems to work...

i stand by my dislike of PORKY'S as it's crude and unfunny, but PORKY'S 2 has one of the funniest moments ever, where a character disguised as a zombie repeats "ugga bugga" over and over and i don't know why, but lord it be hilarious.

and don't worry joe dante, for INNERSPACE and MATINEE alone you'll make it to Movie Heaven...

comment #96

MoisesChiu says ...

Noah,

Much respect, sir. I hope you didn't get the impression that I was telling you that you couldn't have an opinion, far from it. Just clarifying my point.

As for "details" about this guy, Scoot, are you saying you want this to turn into the AICN talkback, which is full of racist vitriol and immigration policy experts?

comment #97

bents75 says ...

I would say anyone here who called Wells an asshole is an asshole themselves. And it's not because he's chosen to be frank about a guy who's best film "A Christmas Story" is boring as hell and largely seems to be liked purely for the sake of liking it. A film which runs 24 hours a day every Christmas and does so with such a loose structure that I'm still never sure where it's beginning and where it's ending when I watch it...but I digress, because what matters here is you're all talking trash, but each and everyone of you assholes will be back here tomorrow reading what else he's written and commenting as if it never happened.

comment #98

Michael says ...

Moises, that's a bullshit move. Saying there'd be reams of haters on other directors had they passed is a weak "everyone does it" argument.

I think the main point for me, and this is something I can't really get past, is that here we have a guy in his 60's, whose gone through a divorce, who has two sons growing up (one doing music in college) that he's trying to spend as much time with as possible (any part of that story seem, I don't know, familiar?). So some shithead snuffs him and his son out, then walks away with nothing as much as a headache. And the man can't get 24 hours peace without Jeffrey Fucking Wells saying "it's horrible BUT".

You would think Wells would be simpatico enough to give this guy the benefit of the doubt. How hard would it have been to just reverse the order of the post?

Shorter example: "This guy didn't make movies I dug, BUT"...and then go on and say something about a guy trying to do right by his kids. It's profoundly disappointing this wasn't done.

comment #99

Earl Hofert says ...

Apparently the only people who will be allowed a measure of respect after their passing will be the executive producer of "Band of the Hand" and the auteurs behind "Factory Girl" and "Blankman"

I presume that when Coppola passes, he will be raked over the coals as a detestable human being for spawning Sofia and when Scorsese dies, it will be another opportunity to describe him as a guy who should have stuck to gangster movies--no doubt he will also mention that his life was obviously a failure because The Departed didn't play at Toronto.

Maybe for a follow-up, Jeff can hang around outside the funeral carrying a banner announcing GOD HATES BOB CLARK while asking mourners how they feel about Robert Rodriguez nailing Rose McGowan.

comment #100

rocco says ...

Moises, you're missing my ENTIRE point...Jeff trashes a guy for commercialism while running a blatantly commercial blog himself...hey, money buys a lot, and to trade artistic integrity to make a living is not inherently wrong, but own up to it!...I react to hypocrisy and double-standards, I'm guilty...Were H-e a film, it wouldn't even be on artistic par w/ 'A Christmas Story'...Jeff links to what OTHER PEOPLE write, throws out a few blurbs of his own, and holds himself as an artist, as a purveyor of passionate film criticism. Nonsense. Glass houses, stones, you know the drill...

I didn't make hyperbolic arguments about Michael Mann or say it's "too soon"...In addition to calling Jeff self-righteous, I'm lamenting his M.O. that EVERY SINGLE TIME someone dies he immediately trashes them. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. It's not insulting, it's prosaic and opportunist. Quick, search "Bob Clark" in the annals of H-e...NADA--a one-liner dismissal at xmas time. To talk about him only once and then again on the day of his death, and to preface it with faux sincerity, is disgraceful.

And why would I want to hang at a blog where all the opinions run in the same direction as mine? That's mindless, there's nothing thought-provoking or challenging about it. That's why I come here...despite the ugly side of the webmaster, I like the diversity of opinion, and just as in real life, I surround myself with people from all different walks of life...makes living much more interesting.

comment #101

bipedalist says ...

When Jeff trashes the "low" people, he is referring to those who aren't on the right side of the tracks. It's very Gatsby-esque, I guess, in the final analysis. But--

"because what matters here is you're all talking trash, but each and everyone of you assholes will be back here tomorrow reading what else he's written and commenting as if it never happened."

Indeed. It is like the pit of hell in here and Jeff is the devil; it is difficult to pull one's self away yet it brings out the absolute worst in people. Someone once said that he writes stuff like this to keep people coming back: negative attention is better than none at all. I do like the commenters here, though, well, most of them. That is the major draw here.

comment #102

Dixon Steele says ...

Shame on you, Jeff. An all time low.

comment #103

I'm Done says ...

I've been reading you Jeff for the last 6 years and I'm just done. I remember when you came out with your best films of the year list with Memento at the top and feeling like I had found a critic who really understood the business and what made good movies. Your arguments were sharp, your pleas for older films being released on DVD were great. I caught "Charley Varrick" here in Los Angeles at your recommendation and loved it.

But lately you've been unreadable. The column turned bitter and the sharp film analysis turned into gossip. And now this. The man is dead. If you didn't like his films just write "Hey, I didn't like his films"." Clark actually made a couple witty cult classics before his string of misses starting in the 80's. Maybe these horror films aren't your thing but that doesn't negate the fact that for a lot of people he was NOT a talentless hack. Most people don't make one good movie let alone four:

1. Deathdream
2. Black Christmas
3. Murder By Decree
3. A Christmas Story (if you didn't like it fine but most people love it, you're fighting a losing battle on this one)

Either you had no idea of his body of work in the 70's or just didn't care. It doesn't matter, I am done with Hollywood-Elsewhere.

comment #104

frankbooth says ...

It's the pit of hell and Jeff is the devil.

I like that. We're all damned souls, eating each other alive while our pompadoured, motorcyle-goggled master cackles behind his keyboard. We hate ourselves, but tomorrow we'll dutifully check in. (Does Dave Poland still have a blog? Anyone know?)

Hieronymous Bosch on the internets. Hell is other cyber-people.

I'll always love The Howling, Joe. Humor, horror, Rob Bottin effects, Dick Miller and a naked Elizabeth Brooks. You can't beat that! And congrats on the good reviews for your Masters of Horror. I don't have cable, but I'll put it in my Greencine queue right now, if it's available.

comment #105

jeffmcm says ...

The connection is that Mr. Dante's Masters of Horror episode has a lot in common with Bob Clark's Deathdream.

comment #106

Jesse Perry says ...

Wrecktum writes: "I agree that A Christmas Story is vastly overrated (a grim, sordid, cheap little film) "

I understand that people might not like ACS, but "grim" and "sordid"? Is there a snuff-film version of the movie that I didn't know about?

comment #107

ArchiveGuy says ...

What JW needs to do is have a Word Doc on his computer that is an ongoing obit column of all the people who die in the calendar year whose work he hated. Then, in a year-end recap, he can spout all the vitriol because it will play more as "year-end summary" and less "body's still warm insensitivity".

Readers will get less upset, JW will look less like a dickhead, and his opinions still see the light of day (hopefully tempered with a little bit of reflection after the months have passed), which is what matters more to him than anything else, it seems.

Win-Win.

comment #108

MovieBob says ...

Dixie: "The implication made last night when I was listening to the story that Nava is an illegal alien, so I take it that's what scooterzz was alluding to."

Tsk tsk! Don't you mean "Undocumented Worker?" Cuz people aren't illegal, man! And... and.. and, like, besides, it was OUR border that crossed HIM and, y'know, stuff! ;)

comment #109

berg says ...

Is there a snuff-film version of the movie that I didn't know about?

YES ... originally Darren McGavin kills Melinda Dillon and stuffs her into the huge box that the Leg Lamp was delivered in ... all the times he keeps muttering "Frageelee" ... also Ralphie brutally beats the bullies to death with his BB Rifle, but not before shooting their eyes out ... also Flick gets his tounge ripped out when it gets frozen to a metal pole after a Double Dog Dare and the other kids grab him by all his limbs and pull really hard in all directions ...

comment #110

jeffmcm says ...

The 1930s and 40s in the Midwest in December were just inherently grim and cheap looking - remember that little thing known as the Depression? It's authentic.

Sordid, though, I can't agree with.

comment #111

drgogol says ...

"In the last year or so, we've lost the two main artistic forces responsible for Christmas Story, Clark and Darren McGavin...."

Jean Shepherd wrote the original stories and the screenplay and narrated, which sounds pretty darned responsible for the final product, no?

(Shepherd died in 1999, FYI)

comment #112

RoyBatty says ...

There are some films you watch because they touch certain emotional centers within you and while other films transcend that and touch your soul. Some folks insist that only movies that achieve the latter are worthwhile. They are the cinema version of people who only read classics and "important" authors like Pynchon, Eco and García Márquez and not King, Turow or even Leonard.

Bob Clark made the first kind of film and in a few instances did it so well he did elevate himself above the rest. It's very telling that not only did he do it more than once, but he did in several different genres.

I am an unabashed, unembarrassed fan of both PORKY'S and A CHRISTMAS STORY. Lost in all the knee-jerk criticism of the film over the more purient scenes was, like AMERICAN PIE 17 years later, that PORKY'S at its core was a rather sentimental story with some unexpected (racism) edges to it. It also contains two scenes that made me cry I was laughing so hard (the Kim Cattrell gym scene and the follow-up with the coaches & principle - to this day when Guy Boyd starts in about the police sketch artist I chuckle).

And long before TBS started doing the marathon, I used to rent A CHRISTMAS STORY during the holidays. There is actually very little syrupy sentimentality in the film. Among holiday films, this humorous period piece rises to the level of minor art. That might just be me, but then again art is subjective isn't it?

The shitty thing about not only Wells' post but most of the obits about Clark is that they don't give the man his due for the level of his craft and entertainment it provided for those who could avoid putting their noses in the air long enough to enjoy their very middle class charms. Peace to your family, bro, some of us got great pleasure from your work.

comment #113

bipedalist says ...

Right on!

comment #114

Jesse Perry says ...

"The 1930s and 40s in the Midwest in December were just inherently grim and cheap looking - remember that little thing known as the Depression? It's authentic.

Sordid, though, I can't agree with."

Jeff, I think you may have inadvertently agreed with me . . . The look is authentic for the times. I don't equate that with "grim." Wrecktum makes ACS (A Christmas Snuff?) sound like the prequel to 8mm.