Dissing McCandless and “Wild”
A producer friend has chosen to disregard the things about Into The Wild that absolutely work — the intimate communing with nature’s grand cathedral, the serenely beautiful ending, Emile Hirsch‘s performance — because of her feelings about the real Chris McCandless, and out of this believes that Sean Penn‘s film may be the weakest wildebeest among the herd of supposed Best Picture nominees (to go by yesterday’s Gurus of Gold posting).
“No way is it a Best Picture nominee,” she wrote this morning. “This is a beautifully shot, self-centered, self-absorbed [film] about a selfish, psychologically damaged brat named Chris McCandless who died of starvation and poisoning while living in a bus in the Alaskan woods. How is this heroic? Why in the world would we admire this guy? He’s pathetic, not heroic. My screening companion asked me if he was mentally ill.
“McCandless’ quest for meaning would have been better served helping people instead of indulging his sense of au natural purity and while contemplating his navel. His story is a tragedy not because he died, but because he died for nothing, proving nothing, finding nothing.
“And his rage against his family? They didn’t beat him, hurt him, deprive him. They were sad and confused people who lied about their past to protect their children, not hurt them. They didn’t seem so horrible after all compared to what he did to them and to his sister, wich was just cruel. Not to call or write for two years? What a reprehensible thing to do. Certainly not the stuff of true heroism.”
Any time people turn an all-knowing eye toward McCandless and stand in judgement, they immediately lose the context and prove themselves unable to comprehend the situation. That said, “Into the Wild” might be in the hunt for Best Picture, but it isn’t a very good film.
Daaammmnnn Kris, I’m surprised to hear you didn’t like it. I actually think the reverse about the film. I thought it was very good but that it wasn’t Best Picture material. Loved Emile’s performance as well as Holbrook’s and Dierker’s, who just about stole the film for me. Keener was good, as usual. Vince Vaughn and his storyline, eh. The Danish couple with the hot dogs needed to be cut (the film is 10-15 mins too long). Loved Wiliam Hurt’s last scene and Eddie Vedder’s soundtrack. Didn’t care for Jena Malone’s voice over.
I want to party with that lady.
Sean Penn should direct Rainn Wilson in the remake of WHY DOES HERR R RUN AMOK?
Truly some of the least insightful thoughts I’ve ever read about a movie. I don’t think this viewer is comfortable with the concept of ambiguity or flawed characters. She naively assumes that all movies must be about doing-the-right-thing. Judging from Penn’s entire body-of-work, that’s clearly not something that interests him.
Yeah, and besides, if someone doesn’t toe-the-line and get a 9-to-5 studio job they’re just wasting their existence. Right?
Haven’t seen it, but I’ve read it and talked to a few outdoors types who’ve read the book and most of them say he’s a pretty stupid kid without respect. I tend to agree. I’m curious to see how I’ll react to the film, mainly to see just how charismatic Penn makes him out to be.
I can’t help but agree with her opinion on McCandless and I even said in my review he was selfish. His selfishness tied in with his death at the end is what hurt the film for me. I graded it high because I think it is extremely well made, but I have to agree the kid was definitely selfish and not to be admired.
Yeah, it’s the selfishness of the character that really stuck with me, but selfishness and foolishness often go with the territory for someone in their early 20s. To only see his flaws and not have some measure of admiration for his attempt to get a hold of the bigger picture in life is unfortunate.
We could all use a little of that idealism even if we don’t carry it to such an extreme.
Mirajeff, do you have any insights beyond that checklist? It seems like the main point of that post was to let everyone know that you’ve seen the movie.
Angel: Mexico Lindo.
Lyle: I don’t see nothin’ so ‘lindo’ about it.
Tector: Just looks like more Texas far as I’m concerned.
Angel: Aw, you don’t have no eyes!
From “Into the Wild Bunch”
Why the assumption that the movie is defending/celebrating this guy? I’ve seen it and I really don’t think its success rests on McCandless’ merit as a person.
I heard a pretty good interview with Jon Krakauer on NPR. It’s a different take on McCandless, yes he was foolish, but it was a young man’s folly and should be viewed as such rather than through the filter of adult experience.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=14564827
Jesus, I just wrote a very long comment but it got lost. Damn. The long and short of it is that this “producer friend” (“She’s my special lady friend.”) is talking out of her ass if she knows what absolutely will not be nominated. Nobody knows how it will go; the script has not been written yet. If the upcoming Oscar movies all tank you can bet that Into the Wild will rise. Also, it’s an idiot’s view to interpret the plot merely as McCandless’ story – there is so much more going on here. It’s about loss and kinship and the realization of what really matters (as in, REALLY matters).
But beyond that, the movie is Sean Penn’s best ever and the Academy has a history of rewarding great leaps like that, especially by actors-turned-directors. It reminds me of Five Easy Pieces, a film that was nominated back in the ’70s. They may not go for Into the Wild but anyone with that kind of blind conviction is fooling themselves.
After all, last year everyone I spoke with said “no way will The Departed win best picture.” And before that, ‘No way will Crash win best picture.” “No way will Denzel and Halle both win,” etc.
I like Gaydos’ Wild Bunch quote. That’s so rad.
Apologies if my other comment also showed up and it sounds like I’m repeating myself…the other fish was so much bigger!!
Grizzly Man without the dinner.
Here we go, fight! fight! Yes the movie is one sitting pose too long, but don’t touch Vaughn or the boobie Danish couple. I could do without the story dragging Keener/Emile scene on the beach, it’s all said better, later, anyway and who cares about her sad story, really, except as it applies to him.
Snaggle voiced Malone roughed me up a little, too, but maybe a little road rash was good for some people.
What are her feelings about Ida Amin and Hannibal Lecter? Wait, I don’t care. I read the book, fancy myself an outdoorsman, and remember thinking of McCandless as a bit of an idiot. INTO THE WILD is a movie now full stop and has to be judged on its own merits. (The book is wildly different in numerous ways.) Certainly an element of the judgement is tied to one’s feelings about the book and even whether Penn sanitized this kid. Chris is dead, but his story is not over a decade later. I applaud Penn for sharing his interpretation of this work and character.
Wells to JD: Read it again — my producer friend wasn’t writing about the movie. Well, in a way, but not really.
I’m with T.Holly, for the last time MiraJeff, keep yer mitts off the Danes. You pull one thread out of the tapestry and the next thing you know…well you can see where this metaphor is headed.
But what do the Danes bring to the story. What knowledge does Chris glean from them? They’re good for a laugh and some boobage. Chris learns something from every other character he comes across except for them. There’s no payoff there. They’re just free spirits, much like Chris was. And Jesse, it wasn’t exactly a full-length review there, guy. Do you really think I sat here thinking up ‘the main point’ of that post, going, gee, I want everyone to know I’ve seen the movie too, like I give a fuck. Grow up, dude. I told you what I liked and what I didn’t like. Agree or disagree but don’t basically call me a showoff because I’m offering an opinion. Besides, it’s out in theaters. Joe Schmoe could’ve seen it. Who cares?
The Danes serve as a foil, illuminating who Chris wasn’t. They are what you say, but unfortunately he doesn’t have time to eat another hot dog and talk about Vegas, he is on a mission.
MiraJeff, are you always so confident in your ability to grasp a film or a scene? Your point about the Danes is well, like something out of a screenwriting class. Is that really the rather boring trajectory you would see for that character and the film? That he “learned something from everyone he met”? Are you sure there is no other possible theme working there? You know, oh, say a theme about love, sex and companionship? Finding your “other,” even though she’s — whatever — stupid, “but I love her anyway.” he didn’t get it yet though. He didn’t get it until it was too late. There, now you have a point for the Danes.
The Danes were another aspect of the idealism of hitting the road. It was a different take on the notion of freedom and adventure and the value of experience.
Also, there is a natural kinship and a bonding that seems to happen between adventurers and yet here was McCandless missing out on the full measure of it because of his stubbornness. It was kind of sad really.
The point is, Into the Wild isn’t necessarily a straight line narrative. It’s an organic whole. An experience in itself and you can’t just arbitrarily start cutting things out because it doesn’t have enough pay off for you or because you need that extra 15 – 20 minutes to catch another screening.
Is he as insufferable as Tim Treadwell?
It absolutely will be nominated. As will Juno for best screenplay and Ellen Page for best actress.
For the record, movies about good, flawless people are more often than not pretty damn boring, which is why you rarely see them.
He’s nothing like Timothy Treadwell except in the aspect that both go into the woods like morons. But Emile Hirsch is not someone the grizzly bears would conclude is “touched.” Treadwell was hilarious. Poor dumb schmuck. McCandless wanted to be alone – he had a gun and killed animals for food — he didn’t think the grizzlys would give him a pass because he was the first human being ever in the world who saw them as the cuddly cuties they really were. His intentions were different.
Zimmergirl, I hear ya. And I know that at the end of the film, Chris realizes all that he was missing out on. Friendship and companionship and other meaningful ‘ships.’ But if the Danes scene wasn’t in the film, would you really be missing out on anything? It’s unnecessary filler that is supposed to serve as a payoff to the preceding scene where Chris asks for a permit to head down the river, doesn’t get one, goes anyway, and almost gets caught by the river police. It would’ve been better if Penn had just cut from Chris getting denied a permit to him not giving a fuck and going on his white water adventure anyways. No need for the Danes to be there. Just quirky travelers in a similar mind-set as Chris. It’s a minor thing. I think you guys are making too much of my criticism. I just thought there were enough interesting characters Chris meets along the way and the film is a tad bit long, and the Danes would be the first to go if a studio asked me to cut another 5 minutes. But they didn’t, did they? I’d love to see the Academy shower praise on Into the Wild but something tells me they won’t. It’s a little too all over the place and Malone’s narration doesn’t help. Not enough screentime with the parents either. I thought it was an excellent film, a totally immersive cinematic journey, I just acknowledge that it has flaws, namely its length, much like Jesse James. Let the bitching begin…
Treadwell was practically a furry. And he died, like all furries should.
Groove, so what she meant, not really, is that Penn and McDickless can’t get nominated for shit because Academy members think like she does.+
The Danes are comic relief and send him to Mexico evading the river police, which makes them untouchable in a movie that needs all three of those things.
That producer seems heartless, maybe this was just an off day for her.
MiraJeff, a studio will never ask you to cut five minutes out of someone else’s film. “Excuse me, man on the street. Would you mind cutting five minutes out of a film Sean Penn just wrote and directed?” It’s a bizarrely hypothetical point to make. Also, since you brought it up, have you watched a version of the film without those scenes and compared it to a version with them? Maybe they have just the right amount of material with Chris interacting with other people prior to his journey to Alaska, and that makes his realization (being alone is only glamorous in theory) that much more poignant and heartbreaking? Are you really telling me five minutes was a dealbreaker for you?
Treadwell was a lunatic. It’s horribly tragic and sad that he died, but it was his own fault. You could argue that Chris didn’t deserve to die. You’d also be right. He was pretty practical about what he was doing.
Rothchild, are your eyes deceiving you? I’m pretty sure I just made the point that 5 minutes was NOT a dealbreaker at all. I believe I called the film “very good” and later, “excellent” and I think Hirsch could be nominated for his incredible performance. Just because I thought Into the Wild and Jesse James were too long doesn’t mean I found their lengths to be dealbreakers. That’d be ridiculous. To be clear, I enjoyed the Danes scene. It made me laugh and it featured tits. What’s not to like? I just didn’t think it was a necessary scene in the film. Would’ve fit nicely as a deleted scene on the DVD. And how could I have seen a version of the film without that scene in it unless I was Sean Penn or worked for Par Vantage? Did you actually think about your post as you typed it or did you just react off the cuff? Some of the people on these talkbacks simply amaze me… common sense, gang. Look into it.
This producer is saying the exact same thing I’ve been saying for a couple months, only she did it better. Krakauer managed to not make the book approving of McCandless, but I almost knew Penn would as soon as I heard he was directing. I’m still going to see it, but my excitement is severely dampened.
He wasn’t practical about what he was doing. Knowing the basic lay of the land and bringing a compass would have helped…
I have a certain respect for the guy, but, like Treadwell, he didn’t respect nature enough.
MiraJeff, did you not a few weeksa go complain about EASTERN PROMISES being too short (which is one of the dumbest criticisms of it I’ve heard repeatedly). Do you want things tight or don’t you?
Mira, don’t even answer that. Answer mine.
Practical?
Didn’t he die within walking distance of a shelter that was stocked with food and water?
And he ate wild potatoes that made it impossible for his body to process glucose.
I don’t have any malice towards him, but going into that wilderness that unprepared isn’t any more “practical” than heading outside in a category 5 hurricane with just an umbrella.
Mira The Danes have to stay. Go rafting sometime and you will understand how without them you would have been taxed at least another five minutes of your time.
John Massey don’t hate the playa, hate the game, I mean once you SEE it.
Burma, they’re two totally different movies. I thought EP’s ending was too abrupt and wanted more. Isn’t it a credit to the film that I would’ve preferred to sit another half-hour to further explore Viggo’s mysterious character? EP, Jesse James and Into the Wild would all be on my top ten of the year right now, but I still think they have flaws and that’s why I don’t think any of them will wind up being Best Picture nominees. Why is everything so black and white on this site? Movies that people are passionate about have lately become discussed here as either perfect masterpieces or pretentious, self-indulgent messes that totally miss their mark. Is there no happy medium? Can’t a great film have flaws? How can a movie like EP not leave you with questions, and how can you not want those questions answered and be satisfied with the amount of information Cronenberg chooses to divulge. At the same time, don’t you wish Dominik had held back on some of the James gang’s forced camraderie and the period dialogue that he’s so in love with? Into the Wild is probably my favorite of those three films but that doesn’t mean its without problems. Same with In the Valley of Elah, which I think I prefer to all three of the other films. Movies aren’t perfect. I’m not saying I have the perfect diagnosis of how to fix them. I’m just stating my opinion of what I felt worked and what didn’t, what I wanted more of and what I wanted less of. I don’t think anyone’s going to re-edit their film with my suggestions in mind. But don’t you think some brave editor needed to speak the fuck up once Jesse James crossed the 2 and a half hour mark?
Penn may approve of McCandliss’ behavior, but he’s openhearted enough in this movie to include other points of view, which is why I think this his best effort. McCandliss’ family is viewed through only his eyes at first, but they become humanized when we see how much they miss their son. Everyone Chris meets shows an alternative family that was willing to accept him if he wasn’t so determined to go to Alaska. As for the Danes, they’re initially viewed as a joke, but I think, in a way, they represent the lack of inhibition McCandliss was striving for.
Just curious Josh, but what did you take from the book exactly?
I hope your producer friend sticks to producing romantic comedies or pure entertainment fluff if she can’t wrap her head around Into the Wild. If your friend wants to see movies with lovable, non-bratty heroes then perhaps she should try something like “The Godfather” or “Pulp Fiction”.
Note to anyone going into the film with baggage;
It is not a documentary. It is not an exact visual recreation of the book. It is not saying the Chris McCandless is a hero, or that you must admire him. It is a FILM based on the journey and relationships leading up to his death, which is how it should be viewed and criticized. I don’t understand the belief that if the picture even slightly romantacizes McCandless or his journey then it is without merit.
I think “Into the Wild” shows him as being selfish, unprepared, brave, angry, misguided, kind, lonely and ultimately, forgiving. There are a full range of emotions present that make the character much more interesting to me, regardless of what I make think of the real individual.
I think Anti-Sardine has said it all.
And
“Treadwell was practically a furry. And he died, like all furries should.”
hahahahaha. Very funny. You brightened my day with that post.
The point here is not to justify what McCandless did; he was a dumb fuck – arrogant, blinded by his own goodness, whatever but the point of the film wasn’t to tell what we already knew or to glorify what he did (yo, Josh, try seeing the film before you go dissing it) but to remind us yet again that we aren’t islands. We need each other, like we need food, like we need water – we die otherwise. Point beautifully made no matter how many bare-tittied Danes were in the film.
At least I didn’t mind the nudity here, not like in Before the Devil Knows You’re Dead where it seemed like poor Marisa Tomei was at last the sum of her parts and nothing more. Yeah I know, great parts maybe but nonetheless, a total gimmick. In Into the Wild the Danes were a great example of people who go to crazy places and do crazy things — but there was a reason; they were doing it together. It might sound corny but to Sean Penn, it represents something person, his own personal journey, if you will. McCandless thought he didn’t need anyone – he blew through relationships while other mere mortals showed their need. Boy was he wrong, eh? All of the philosophy in the world can’t replace primal need.
Ok Zimmergirl, great point about the Danes doing it together. I never looked at it that way. It’s such a simple observation and yet, it speaks volumes. That perspective never occured to me. Very interesting. Thanks for the insight.
Will anyone notice that the screenplay of “Into the Wild” is effing brilliant? Sean should start wearing tortoise-shell glasses and a pocket protector and hang out with his VAIO at Starbucks so the WGA will notice him. Or something.
To wit:
“We’re PROUD of Jesse around here. I reckon all America’s a little proud of him. I dunno why. Maybe it’s because he was bold — and lawless — the way we all like to be, once in a while.”
Henry Hull in “Into the Wild Jesse James”
“McCandless’ quest for meaning would have been better served helping people…”
Starving to death is a far better fate than being forced to listen to a Hollywood producer lecture about altruism.
“All of the philosophy in the world can’t replace primal need.”
Zimmergirl nailed it.
Saw it last night. I think it’s a masterpiece.
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