comment #1

longrunner says ...

Films like this only come along once in a lifetime.

Hyperpole.

comment #2

Mark says ...

why not mention The Matrix among those 1999 films? it's better and more groundbreaking than all of those.

comment #3

Rich S. says ...

"the startling way the film redefined cinematic storytelling...."

Uh, okay. This guy must not see many films (or at least not many films not starring Batman).

comment #4

actionman says ...

1999 was an emabarassment of cinematic riches.

So was last year.

I still think The Fall is the best movie I've seen this year but nobody is giving that film the time of day. Shame.

comment #5

rgmax99 says ...

The Dark Knight is a fine technical accomplishment, however it's extremely flawed. The storyline is borderline incoherent, and it's about 30 minutes too long.

comment #6

DavidF says ...

It's a really good movie and if got a Best Pic nom I guess I wouldn't mind (the Four Weddings/Full Monty/Little Miss Sunshine slot) but to win??

Really? I have to watch it again, clearly.
There's a certain amount of hyperbole going on out there. Did he really compare TDK to Fight Club?

Besides, even in retrospect those 1999 films are too edgy for Oscars. It'll be a long time before you see stuff like Fight Club and Matrix getting nominated, especially together. We've had a fantasy movie, and a genre cop movie win in the last few years - what more do you want?

In the meantime, I'm hoping we have this discussion about Watchmen next year...

comment #7

bluefugue says ...

>Films like this only come along once in a lifetime.

>Hyperpole.

Yes, an utterly absurd statement, particularly when you consider that the entire history of cinema has been less than two human lifespans placed end-to-end.

comment #8

bluefugue says ...

Oh, by the way, anybody who calls "Man On The Moon" a groundbreaking film is being ridiculously generous and imprecise with that term. "Man On The Moon" was an utterly conventional docudrama that featured an impressive lead performance.

comment #9

bluefugue says ...

And I'm utterly going to stop writing "utterly" for a while.

comment #10

DarthCorleone says ...

First, let's all just agree that The Dark Knight is the best picture of the year...

It's tough to buy this argument when you can't agree on the rather critical first and primary premise.

comment #11

drbob says ...

I have to second rgmax99's comments. The Dark Knight is a narrative mess. As merely one example - why did Gordon fake his own death? What purpose did it serve other than to freak out his own wife? His fake death did not seem to play any role in Batman/Dent's scheme to capture the Joker.

comment #12

Mark says ...

TDK for sure should be nominated. Name five other movies that will be remembered in 10 years. i mean, it's absurd that The Green Mile and Cider House got nominated over The Matrix. Simply sweeping the tech awards was not enough recognition.

comment #13

actionman says ...

Gordon faked his death to protect his family.

comment #14

theultimatebiu says ...

TDK could get a nod but I really don't get the pent up hype for it. It was a good movie...a very good movie but it really was a narrative mess and its major saving grace was Ledger's Joker and the excellent action. It's a technical marvel...nothing more.

comment #15

The Winchester says ...

Actionman, you really liked the Fall that much? Even with Synechdoche and Rambo out this year? I thought The Fall was visually stunning (Needs a cinematography nod, for sure), but I thought it was a narrative mess, and it just falls apart at the end. Again, best looking movie this year, though. Loved that blue city.

comment #16

The Lord of Misrule says ...

Strangely enough, I'm getting an Obama vibe from this thing.

In many ways the video, with all of its accompaying reviews reminds me of the campaign we all just went through...which is a good thing, I guess, insofar as I do believe TDK deserves a shot at awards recognition.

And if it worked for our Presedent Elect...

comment #17

actionman says ...

Winchester: I was meh on Rambo. It had some fun, gory action but it was pretty stale overall.

The Fall transfixed me -- both visually and narratively -- like no other film this year so far, with the possible exception of Synecdoche, NY.

Why did you feel the narrative was a mess? I have watched it numerous times now and I just love it. It gets better and richer with every viewing. And you felt it fell apart at the end? How?

Colin Watkinson REALLY deserves a cinematography nod.

comment #18

D.Z. says ...

Mark: The Matrix was a decent remake of Megazone 23 and Ghost in the Shell, but didn't offer much otherwise.

action: To me, '99 had a lot more disposable pretentious and generic flicks than was usual during that decade-with only a few real gems in the mix. I think the reason people consider it a good year was because
they genuinely believed in that Y2K crap. And, as a result of that nonsense, they conditioned themselves to believe that they were experiencing the peak of quality movie-making. But, as Jeff pointed out with Green Mile, most of those pictures don't really hold up well nowadays. Still, if there was any pic that really should've won for that year, it should have been South Park. It's a shame it lost to that "homosexuals are nazis" movie.

bob: I was complaining about the Gordon sub-plot, too. Totally worthless.

Anyway, I consider Iron Man to be the more socially relevant comic book movie, but TDK will win Best Picture because it's not the best picture. I'm just glad the Annies voted for Kung Fu Panda over Another Pixar Movie.

comment #19

p.Vice says ...

I'm sure that "once in a lifetime" will be replaced with "Summer 2011" once WB can get Nolan started on the next movie.

And hey, I bet they're running Best Actor FYC ads for Stallone in Rambo. More or less the same as this bullshit.

comment #20

Josh Massey says ...

First, let's all just agree that The Dark Knight is the best picture of the year...

Hell, I really liked it, but it was only the second best sequel of the year - behind Rambo.

The Fall should get some tech noms, for sure, and I'd also love to see that little girl get one for supporting actress.

comment #21

Deathtongue_Groupie says ...

2nd Winchester's comments, RE: The Fall. It should fucking win the cinematography award, but it just loses steam in the last act.

As to The Dark Knight, I think Sony blew the marketing opportunity of a lifetime (if we are going to use that bit of hyperbole) to use this film to goose Blu-Ray sales this month.

I think when January arrives and the sales numbers are finalized, December 2008 will set a record for most television sets sold EVER. The Feb '09 deadline is going to put a shitload of LCD's and Plasmas under trees all across America.

Sony should have gone to Warner Bros and offered something on the scale of $100M to make TDK exclusively a Blu-Ray disc until January 22nd. Perhaps even only available with new players. Not only would that have jump started sales of players, but then Warner Bros could have used whatever nominations beyond Ledger's part of the DVD drive.

comment #22

Dan Revill says ...

That promo video was cut really well. Makes me excited for the BD release next week.
I am not so sure TDK's battle uphill is as big as others claim it to be. Every LOTR film was nominated in the past ten years...and I think that TDK is way more accessible than those films are to the average Joe.
I can see it being nominated, but winning may be a stretch. Stranger things have happened.

For what it's worth, I love The Fall. I don't think the ending is a big a mess as some seem to. I think given Roy's state of mind, it totally jives...it was unexpected in many ways, but yeah, I dig it. I won't be surprised if The Fall fails to receive any technical nominations. I'm just saying.

comment #23

D.Z. says ...

Deathtongue: With TDK on home video, I imagine the following scenarios: 1) It suffers a similar effect of Shrek 2, where people ended up seeing it in theaters so much that they didn't care if it was on DVD. 2) It outsells the dvd version, but does not convince people to buy BD discs of older movies they have in their collections. 3) It creates a home video ghetto in which the newer titles on BD are priced-to-own, while the BD classics have a higher price similar to the one adapted by Criterion.

comment #24

Luke Y. Thompson says ...

actionman -- thanks for reminding me that I missed The Fall.

Gotta go call someone about a screener.

comment #25

Josh Massey says ...

Or just Netflix the damn thing.

comment #26

Deathtongue_Groupie says ...

D.Z - do yourself a favor before you ever write "everyone saw it in the theaters" again: divide the gross of TDK by the average ticket price and then compare that with the population of the country.

Get what an ignorant statement that is?

Understand just how much trouble the industry is actually in now?

comment #27

Mjs says ...

There are people that actually thought Rambo was good? Or are you all just being silly and sarcastic? Rambo was a terrible movie. Still only one good film in that series, and it was the first one.

comment #28

OregonEd says ...

"Rambo" was fun; sure it wasn't as good as the first one, but it was balls to the wall, absurd, over the top action and violence. Art it's not, nor is it meant to be.

comment #29

OregonEd says ...

Interesting...I started to write a second paragraph and type fart decided I was done.

comment #30

K. Bowen says ...

The Dark Knight has its issues. There were a few films this year that I liked better. But no studio film this year was more ambitious and no other studio film was as successful in meeting its ambitions. IAre there some narrative nitpicks? Yes. Compared the multilayered theintellectual challenges, it seems small to me.

comment #31

D.Z. says ...

Deathtongue: Well, that's not my problem. But this might be for TDK... http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117996696.html?categoryid=13&cs=1

comment #32

Edward Havens says ...

Mark said "TDK for sure should be nominated. Name five other movies that will be remembered in 10 years."

Awards aren't about what may or may not be remembered in one year or five years or ten years or a hundred years. Awards are for the here and now. How the people of the day reacted to the films of that moment. Awards are not perfect, and should never be expected to be perfect. Fight Club not get nominated for any major award doesn't make it any lesser of a film, just as American Beauty winning Best Picture doesn't mean was a better movie then, or now. It just means that is how a specific group of 6000 or so people felt about cinema at that moment. Nothing more. Nothing less.

As for TDK, it is deserving of four nominations at the most: Best Supporting Actor, Best Cinematography, Best Sound and Best Sound Effects Editing. That's it. Nothing more.

comment #33

markj says ...

Comic book fans really shouldn't be allowed to talk about cinema should they?

Nolan can't direct action for starters (a bit like previous Batman director Burton). And the last half hour was a dogs breakfast. Add to that one of the dullest central performances i've ever seen (step forward Mr Bale) and some massive plot holes (Batman not going back to save his fundraising guests from The Joker and his goons).

So - "An unparalled and extraordinary achievement of filmmaking that only happens on rare occasions when lightning strikes." ? No, not at all i'm afraid.

comment #34

Edward Havens says ...

Deathtongue said: "do yourself a favor before you ever write "everyone saw it in the theaters" again: divide the gross of TDK by the average ticket price and then compare that with the population of the country."

Perhaps you should read what he said and quote DZ accurately. DZ did not say "everyone saw it in the theatres" DZ said they could imagine a scenario where, and this is the exact quote, "It suffers a similar effect of Shrek 2, where people ended up seeing it in theaters so much that they didn't care if it was on DVD."

Not "everyone." Just an unspecific "people." And it's a scenario I can see happening as well. Not everyone who saw the film in theatres is going to buy it on DVD or Blu-Ray, just as not everyone who buys it on DVD or Blu-Ray saw it in theatres. So the question is, how many of the roughly 55-60m people who saw the film in theatres is going to buy the video? Hell, Titanic isn't the best selling DVD of all time. Finding Nemo is, and it only 16th on the list of domestic theatrical grosses.

Fact of the matter is, TDK is going to suffer from its downgrade from the big screen to the home screen far worse than most movies, especially when you factor in the untold millions who saw and loved TDK on the IMAX screen. I don't care if you have Jerry Bruckheimer money, the best home video system in the world is going to pale in comparison to what tens of thousands of ticket buyers experienced at my own theatre, with its digital projection and Dolby Digital sound processor with THX certification (yes, there are still some theatres out there willing to stay THX certified). Even today, most people do not have HDTV-ready monitors, Blu-ray players or even the most rudimentary home theatre sound systems. And that is going to play a major factor in how well it is going to be received by buyers in this weak economy.

comment #35

K. Bowen says ...

"Awards aren't about what may or may not be remembered in one year or five years or ten years or a hundred years. Awards are for the here and now. How the people of the day reacted to the films of that moment. "

I would say the box office makes TDK would seem to indicate that this is the film of this moment.

"Fact of the matter is, TDK is going to suffer from its downgrade from the big screen to the home screen far worse than most movies, especially when you factor in the untold millions who saw and loved TDK on the IMAX screen. "

Yep, it certainly has killed the reputation of 2001:A Space Odyessey. [/rolleyes]

comment #36

Edward Havens says ...

Which is why 2001 is amongst the best selling videos of all time!

comment #37

Christian says ...

I just had a look at the website, darkcampaign.com and it has ASTROTURFING written all over it. A "grassroots campaign"? Yeah, sure.

comment #38

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