109 thoughts on “Creep

  1. PastePotPete on said:

    They still let Dennis Miller on tv?

  2. I used to really respect Miller as a comedian before he got older and grouchier. At some point after that debacle with ABC football, he soured big time. I actually have four of his books. Now I’m ashamed to admit I own them.

  3. It’s amazing when these people paint themselves into a corner the way Miller has. A few years ago he was on tour, and came to our lovely lefty bastion of SF and he was doing endless radio interviews trying to convince people that he was really still a libertarian, not a right-wing nut-job. Didn’t really help his ticket sales here. It’s one thing to say you’re on Bush’s side immediately after 9/11; it’s another to jump into the mud with the fringe. Even Ron Silver said at the time that he disagreed with the GOP on a range of other issues. Miller just took a list of Hannity/O’Reilly talking points and ran them into the ground for 8 years.

  4. Dennis Miller has become a major douche. Basically, he wet his pants after 9/11 happened and is now happy to nuzzle up to any authoritarian who promises to keep him safe from the big, bad world.

  5. When a pampered insecure enterainter loses his audience, as Miller did, after the Monday Night football debacle exposed him as a lightweight and a phony, he has to go find another one. Right Wingers love anyone who flatters them.

  6. Wow, how fucked are you when you can actually compel O’Reilly to take the “good cop” pose?…

    Well put, Glenn

    I have to explain to my kids that Denis Miller used to be funny and known for his brand of intelligent humor.

  7. At this point, I’m just hoping for a Third Act redemption.

    Has there BEEN a more tragic collapse in modern Comedy than Miller? His earlier rapid-fire-guy-whos-smarter-than-you style is literally the foundation on which Daily Show, Colbert etc. are built… but the originator has turned into a shadow of himself.

  8. I don’t want to get off on a rant here, but Miller’s just proving his continued irrelevance yet again.

  9. Dennis is just making business decisions. Many, many years ago he was one of the driving forces in comedy, but I really don’t remember any of this right-wing nut-job stuff coming through his humor then. The years went on, his career waned, and he sat back and saw Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter making some big bucks pandering to the right. Bingo! Career move! Miller becomes O’Reilly’s lap dog and is suddenly–A FUNNY CONSERVATIVE! After all, Fox “News” ratings are the highest on cable–why not hitch your wagon to the biggest horse? Deep down I really wonder if he believes half–even a quarter–of the shit he blabs. But, hey, he seems to have a regular gig and is still managing to get his face on the tube. He does, however, seem to still be his own biggest fan.

  10. Maybe he’ll do a minstrel show for his next appearance.

    Michael Steele, the current RNC chair, must love seeing stuff like this when he’s trying to do GOP outreach to black and Hispanic voters.

  11. Miller quit being funny during his second year at SNL doing weekend update. I’ve really found his references as that much genius. He’s like a rapper who skims the index of a history book. Dana Carvey does Dennis better than Dennis. He’s America’s Yakov Smirnov

    Far as the joke goes – What about Sam Alito’s hearing where he talked about how being a Italian Catholic influences his view of laws. Where was the funny for Dennis?

  12. When a pampered insecure enterainter loses his audience, as Miller did, after the Monday Night football debacle exposed him as a lightweight and a phony

    How many times has Olbermann been let go, or run afoul of his colleagues or superiors?

    It doesn’t mean anything. The awful timing and delivery in this spot are damning enough.

  13. Apples and Oranges. I don’t remember Olbermann’s stint in SNL, his movies, comedy albums…am I missing something?

    As creepingmalaise, said, a lazy has-been, who had been running on empty for years, needed an audience and found one.

  14. I can remember when Dennis Miller was funny, but that’s because I’m kind of old.

    When was the last time he did SNL Weekend Update? 1990? He was already getting grumpy and sour back then.

    Kids, if you’re 25 years old now, the last time Dennis Miler was funny was back before you entered kindergarten.

  15. “They still let Dennis Miller on tv?”

    Only on the channel that actually gets ratings. Yes, you are out of touch.

    They need to ask Sotomayor frankly:

    “If a white male had said the inverse of what you said, should they have been nominated to the Supreme Court?”

  16. Well I’m under 25 and I remember liking his HBO show. He would always end it with an MST3K style riff on funny political pictures.

    What he’s doing now is depressing.

  17. creepingmalaise wrote:

    The years went on, his career waned, and he sat back and saw Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter making some big bucks pandering to the right. Bingo! Career move! Miller becomes O’Reilly’s lap dog and is suddenly–A FUNNY CONSERVATIVE! After all, Fox “News” ratings are the highest on cable–why not hitch your wagon to the biggest horse?

    Surprised Miller hasn’t written a “how I turned Right” book like, say, Roger Simon.

  18. “They need to ask Sotomayor frankly:

    ‘If a white male had said the inverse of what you said, should they have been nominated to the Supreme Court?’”

    It’s a fair question and one that will be asked and answered during her confirmation hearing. Before that explanation I think people shouldn’t be throwing around terms like “racist” nor should they be doubling down on crap like Miller’s routine.

  19. I used to enjoy his HBO show here and there, but that was definitely the beginning of the end . . . his “rants” became the show’s main focus and came off as so tone-deaf, self-absorbed and divorced-from-reality that the clip where he shouts about being “A LATINA WOMAN” with a flower between his teeth actually seems like its logical endpoint.

  20. “It’s a fair question and one that will be asked and answered during her confirmation hearing. Before that explanation I think people shouldn’t be throwing around terms like “racist” nor should they be doubling down on crap like Miller’s routine.”

    I’m all for a fair confirmation hearing. And I agree, the term ‘racist’ is thrown around way too much these days.

  21. when has it become a sin in America to not take pride in yourself? Did you except this woman to just say, “A Latina woman is only worthy of cleaning the toilets of rich white men?

    Miller is only O’Reilly’s Fox lapdog because all attempts to give Miller a real show on Fox have been development failures. He’s not able to do much but sit back while Colbert and Stewart have completely passed his sad career. While you might view the duo as lefties – they have no problem attacking the Democrats when they mess up like idiots.

    Miller is about as useful as a bag of chattering teeth.

  22. Miller has changed…getting older?

    I say let the lady get to the hearings in one piece,

    then debated the record…tearing her apart does

    no one any good.

  23. I used to think Dennis Miller was hilarious until I found out that he had a different political point of view than I do.

    And no one had better DARE say anything even remotely negative towards Obama’s SCOTUS pick! She’s a WOMAN. A Latina Woman. She is above scrutiny.

    And if you disagree with me than you are worse than Hitler.

  24. You are absolutely right, Travis. Thank God we live in a country where people like you can be as ignorant, racist, intolerant and hateful as you want to be. It wouldn’t be the USA without you, Travis. So keep on being the small-minded douchebag that you always have been and that you always will be. Because when the blacks and the latinos are running this country, you’ll probably be rounded up and shot on sight.

  25. “How do I respond to someone who says 90% of the economic collapse was due to the Big Government?”

    Nod.

  26. A thank you, Milk Man for playing your part so thoughtfully.

    “The president just selected a candidate for a lifetime appointment to the Supreme Court.”

    “I see. I’ll be interested in reviewing this person’s past judicial record and looking over their qualifications to see if I think they’ll make a good justice.”

    “RACIST! SEXIST!”

    “Shit! I’m sorry. I didn’t know she was a Hispanic Woman. She’ll be great! Really, I’m sorry! Don’t tell anyone what I bigot I just was.”

  27. “If a white male had said the inverse of what you said, should they have been nominated to the Supreme Court?”

    If one reads the full context of Sotomayor’s remark, one sees what she meant–that she believes a person with broad experience enriched in part by cultural heritage would make “wiser” decisions than someone raised in isolation without such human experiences. This was written in response to the quote that a “wise man” and a “wise woman” should reach the same decision in each case, as if the facts and law presented were some kind of math problem. She sees the getting of judicial wisdom as a process rooted in concrete human experience versus theoretical abstraction. That’s the point to be debated. The Latina versus white man comparison was, on her part, an unnecessary distraction from her thesis, which was more about individual experience.

  28. “RACIST! SEXIST!”

    “Shit! I’m sorry. I didn’t know she was a Hispanic Woman. She’ll be great! Really, I’m sorry! Don’t tell anyone what I bigot I just was.”

    You should tune yourself in. The people who are crying “RACIST!” and “bigot” are the cowards along the far right fringe, and they’re aiming this slander at the judge. No reasonable person would deny the Republicans the opportunity to thoughtfully review her record and qualifications and to vote against her. But to compare her to David Duke and the KKK is clearly desperate and nuts.

  29. Nothing more juvenile or pathetic than white people worrying about their place at the head of the table. Don’t fret so much, guys. I get the feeling white people would rather blow up the planet than let anyone else be in charge. And Mowkeka: RaHoWa. Is that right? Is that how you spell it? If not, then let me just give you a hearty Oi!

  30. - America’s Yakov Smirnov -

    Howls. I will be stealing that one corey3rd.

    For the record, Miller was funny for a few years back in the late 80′s. But yeah, the guy has turned into the far right’s circus geek. Yikes

  31. “And no one had better DARE say anything even remotely negative towards Obama’s SCOTUS pick!”

    If you’re using this to defend Dennis Miller’s statement, and say we shouldn’t be criticizing it, you’re going to have to explain where the legitimate negative criticism that he’s making is when he says that she’s a Latina. Because that’s his sole criticism, that she’s not qualified because she’s Latina. And that’s why people are criticizing him.

  32. What is so wonderful about living in this age, is that when right wing echo chamber starts mouthing off about something you don’t have to wait long for the jaw-dropping hypocrisy to arrive.

    Case in point, this statement:

    “When I get a case about discrimination, I have to think about people in my own family who suffered discrimination because of their ethnic background or because of religion or because of gender. And I do take that into account.”

    Yet when a white man said these things, Rush/Beck/Miller/Hannity and the rest of the Douche Patrol did not go off ranting about it tainting “their” pristine Supreme Court. For those who haven’t already seen it repeatedly in the last few days, the speaker was Samuel Alito.

  33. “When you’re a white male.”

    Hear, hear. The only oppressed minority that it’s okay to make fun of is the one that isn’t oppressed and isn’t a minority!

    And will you black stand up comedians stop telling everybody I walk like that? WE DON’T ALL WALK THE SAME WAY YOU RACISTS!

  34. At first I thought he was going to do a parody of O’Reilly, but then I remembered that Miller’s been a Republican for the last ten years if not more. I don’t know who’s in worse shape, though. Him or Lovitz.

  35. YRG – Lovitz has said one funny thing in the last ten years (“Do you want to fuck or do you want to watch a movie?”), so Lovitz wins.

  36. Miller always had a conservative streak — I remember a Playboy interview from the early ’90s where he mentioned being anti-abortion and pro-death penalty — but the difference back then was he didn’t play favorites with his comedy, and went after everyone equally.

    Once he said making fun of the president was off-limits because he liked the guy, that was the beginning of his losing it. The old Miller would have had some choice words for any and all “pundit”-driven cable news shows, whether Olbermann or O’Reilly.

  37. “Miller always had a conservative streak ”

    I think comedy in general in the ’80′s had a bit more of a conservative streak.

  38. “when has it become a sin in America to not take pride in yourself?”

    When you’re a white male.

    Game over.

  39. Does anyone know what political party Zach Galifianakis belongs to, or who he voted for in the last few elections? I wanted to see “The Hangover” and the information will help determine whether or not I find him funny.

  40. “If you’re using this to defend Dennis Miller’s statement, and say we shouldn’t be criticizing it, you’re going to have to explain where the legitimate negative criticism that he’s making is when he says that she’s a Latina. Because that’s his sole criticism, that she’s not qualified because she’s Latina. And that’s why people are criticizing him.”

    You got all of that from the above Media Matters clip? Really?

    Dennis Miller said that she wasn’t qualified because she’s a Latina? Uh, no.

    Dennis Miller, who is, by the way, a STAND-UP COMEDIAN, was making a joke directed at the media reaction to the choice of Sotomayor for SCOTUS. At the time the above clip aired, practically all the stories you heard on the news had to do with her being a Latina and how wonderful and historic the selection was.

    No, it wasn’t that funny, really. (though Miller often is very funny) But his point was that nobody was looking past her gender and ethnicity and there was a general mood in the media that she was a perfect pick for no other reason than her race and sex.

  41. “But his point was that nobody was looking past her gender and ethnicity and there was a general mood in the media that she was a perfect pick for no other reason than her race and sex.”

    I think you’re reading a *lot* more into it than I am. He’s making fun of her as a pick, and the only thing he’s making fun of about her is that she’s a Latina. It’s not some incredibly subtle critique of the media like you’re making it out to be.

    I’d agree that he wasn’t technically out-and-out saying that she’s not qualified because she’s a Latina; I was trying to make some sort of connection between what he said and an actual criticism of her qualifications, because you seemed so hell-bent on defending what he said as a reasonable criticism, whereas (as you now have agreed) there’s no actual criticism in there.

  42. Oh, I agree with you, Travis. Dennis Miller’s politics have absolutely nothing to do with his politics and everything to do with him being a frightened little man who flinches at anything that threatens his sense of the status quo. That’s why he’s not funny. That’s why all people who are not funny are not funny. Because change and that which they perceive to be chaotic scares the shit out of them. So they attack. And act like bullies. And bullies are not funny. Any great comedy come out of the Third Reich? No. The Khmer Rouge? No. There’s never been a good Klan stand-up. Ask yourself why that is? How come bigots and racists and sociopaths aren’t funny? I mean, they themselves, with thier extremist ideas and silly costumes are inherently funny, but they don’t produce anything that is funny, at least, not intentionally. Because humor is the sign of a malleable, humane, and complex intelligence that is able to see all the different sides of whatever it is that it’s looking at. The key word being humane. That is not a word I would use to describe Dennis Miller, O’Reilly, Limbaugh, Glenn Beck or anyone else of that ilk.

  43. I look forward to the day when minority appointments, elections, positions of authority, etc., are so commonplace that these discussions just stop existing. I wonder if it will happen in my lifetime. We unfortunately live in an era in which the glass ceiling is still a very real phenomenon.

  44. Darth – I don’t think we’re going to see a Muslim president in the next century (as a for instance), so probably not within any of our lifetimes, no.

    (Note: I mean an open Muslim, not a secret Muslim like Obama naturally is [I'm not being racist, I'm just saying, look at his name, am I right?])

  45. “When I get a case about discrimination, I have to think about people in my own family who suffered discrimination because of their ethnic background or because of religion or because of gender. And I do take that into account.” -samuel alito

    “death tongue” already put this up, but I thought it was worth reposting.

    The hypocrisy is pretty stunning.

  46. And I would argue Miller started to lost his comedy edge when he moved to Santa Barbara and became more worried about the kiddies college tuition than speaking truth to power.

    in comedy, any time you relentlessly pound on one side while giving the other a pass, you time being funny is coming to an end.

    In my eyes, Bill Maher is moving down this same path…

  47. And then, G Gordon Liddy stepped in and snatched the “asshole of the week” award from Millers hands.

    “Let’s hope that the key conferences aren’t when [Sotomayor]‘s menstruating or something, or just before she’s going to menstruate. That would really be bad. Lord knows what we would get then,” – G. Gordon Liddy.

  48. By the way Crabtree your take on this is so spot on you should be applauded. Milkman your a tool, get over yourself, your wrong on this one.

  49. Miller always had a conservative streak — I remember a Playboy interview from the early ’90s where he mentioned being anti-abortion and pro-death penalty — but the difference back then was he didn’t play favorites with his comedy, and went after everyone equally.

    Once he said making fun of the president was off-limits because he liked the guy, that was the beginning of his losing it. The old Miller would have had some choice words for any and all “pundit”-driven cable news shows, whether Olbermann or O’Reilly.

  50. Does anyone in their right mind really think Sotomayor believes Latina’s are BETTER than white people? I mean, honestly, are any of you GENUINELY offended by this? Or is this all just phony outrage, maybe rooted in resentment at how often you think white people are unfairly characterized as racist?

    The whole “if a white man said this” argument is intellectually phony, by the way. It DOES in fact matter WHO speaks the words you’re (supposedly) offended by.

  51. I used to base a lot of my stand up comedy on Miller’s style, and it was a LONG TIME AGO.

    Miller lost his funny when he got his hair transplant and a staple from the procedure got lodged on his brain.

    All he does now is laugh at his own unfunny jokes.

    Dennis, man, time to retire.

  52. Well, Gordon27… it’s not that I’m defending Miller…. and that’s not just my “opinion”. I actually saw the entire bit and I also heard Miller talking about it on his radio show. (as opposed to watching snippets on Media Matters, MSNBC or reading about it on DailyKos)

    His take was that 36 hours into the pick just about the only thing he heard about her in the media was that she was a “strong Hispanic woman from a hard-scrabble up-bringing in the Bronx.”

    Everywhere you turned we heard about what a great “life story” she had.

    But then if Bush had appointed Miguel Estrada y’all would’ve been cool with that, right? We would’ve all celebrated what a history-making pick that was and nobody here would’ve said ANYTHING negative about him.

  53. “it’s not that I’m defending Miller”

    How could I possibly assume that?

    “and that’s not just my “opinion”.”

    Ah, of course not.

    “But then if Bush had appointed Miguel Estrada y’all would’ve been cool with that, right?”

    If you’re going to just recycle your talking points, I’m going to recycle my response from the same thread.

    The amazing thing, to me, about idiotic Republicans who repeat stuff like this is that they always say the same thing. “If just nominating a minority is enough, then why did they criticize our minorities when we nominated them?”

    They consistently assume the first part — it’s their assumption as to why liberals like specific candidates, which has no basis in reality — and then try to “disprove” the first part by laying out the second part. It’s hilarious. It’s the same argument every time, and it’s so entrenched they don’t see how stupid it is.

  54. My argument is with the Liberal usage of the “human shield”.

    That is, put forth someone who’s ethnicity, life story, gender or disability makes them above criticism.

    “Just TRY to say anything substantive against this person. If you do, we’ll simply call you a racist. (or a sexist, or just an all-around awful person)!”

  55. Travis – again and again, I have to ask — what is this “substantive” point that MIller is making about her? The only point you’ve even pretended he was making was about “the media” and (apparently) had nothing to do with her.

    That’s what’s funny here; you’re holding up “She is Spanish!” as a substantive point. Meanwhile, you’re bringing up minorities that Republicans have supported and Democrats haven’t and, rather than recognizing that it disproves your belief that Democrats only support people because they are minorities, you use it as supposed proof that Democrats are hypocrites. It comes from years of listening to right-wing talking points in an echo chamber and letting your critical facilities wilt over years of underuse.

  56. Travis, I’m a liberal and I don’t like Sotomayor because I don’t think she is a liberal. But I WILL defend her against these bullshit attacks, because they’re so infused with white male defensiveness and paranoia it’s nauseating. Bring on the substantive criticism, and then if you’re called a racist I’ll defend you. But so far the only complaint I’ve heard is that she expressed some ethic pride eight years ago.

  57. Gordon27…. let’s go over the list….

    - use of “echo chamber” (check)

    - use of “right-wing talking points” (check)

    - use of “hate radio” (no)

    - use of the word “machine” following “attack” or “smear” (no)

    - usage of and inference of LOVE for the following: Coulter, Rush, Beck, O’Rielly, Hannity (partial credit)

    - general name calling, i.e. “stupid”, racist, etc. (check)

    good work, but there’s room for improvement

  58. “these attacks”? Miller was not “attacking” her. Again… I SAW THE ENTIRE PIECE and I’ve heard him talk about her on his radio show. He doesn’t have a strong opinion about her one way or another.

    O’Reilly has Miller on his show now and then in segments where Miller gives his take on current events, usually in a comic, (or attempted comic) way.

    And I never said that saying she is “Spanish” is a substantive position.

    Are you really missing the point that much?

    In the first 24 hours of news reporting (CNN, NBC, ABC, CBS TV and radio, Evil Fox News, MSNBC) practically the only thing you heard about this person was that she was a Latina who grew up poor in the Bronx and that she was a Yankee fan. Miller was poking fun at the hyperventilations of the press over the “historic nomination of this Hispanic woman with the great life story”.

    You watch a two minute clip cut together by Media Matters, I watch the entire segment plus I listened to Miller discuss the issue further on the radio. Defer to me on this one.

  59. Crabtree, I’ve read your comments and all you’re really doing is harping about the opinions of a bunch of nobodies posting anonymous comments on a movie website. The “human shield” angle is bogus. Did it somehow escape you that a whole bunch of white men were calling Sotomayor a racist? That is the “substantive” criticism you’re defending?

    Meanwhile, everyone else is talking about Miller’s (and a lot of other) national television commentary that, sadly, has undue influence on a lot of people who find it impossible to have opinions of their own and instead rely on someone to figure it out for them. I think it can conclusively be stated that Dennis Miller is not someone who should be telling people what to think.

    Your insistence of obfuscating the real issue here spells out where you’re coming from. Next.

  60. Please.

    Dennis Miller would be the first person to agree with you that he is not someone who should be telling people what to think.

    And what’s the real issue here? Miller stated that she will be confirmed and he doesn’t have a problem with that.

    And this very clip posting on Media Matters and here is exactly why the “human shield” angle is not bogus. The media have set her up as “unattackable” because she is a Hispanic woman. “Be very careful when talking about her”. (I’m sure you’ve heard that)

    Democrats have been all over the news saying essentially that they hope she serves as a trap for the Right. If they, (republicans) vote against her or in any way don’t approve of her selection then they will further alienate themselves from the Hispanic community and prove that they are ALL a bunch of racists.

    And AGAIN, all I’m “defending” is Miller. He did NOT call Sotomayer a racist. That is not substantive and I am not defending it. Holy shit some of you people here are knee-jerk. Don’t subscribe to The Nation or watch MSNBC every night and suddenly you’re a Rush/Hannity/Fox-loving redneck white supremist John Birch Society Rethuglican.

    (and what makes you so sure I’m white, anyway?)

    I do agree with your first sentence, p.Vice.

  61. This thread makes me love Milkman even more.

    And Crabtree… even YOU know that you’re really stretching here. You post two responses in a row multiple times. Obviously you know that you’re backed up against the wall and you’re sort of wrong.

  62. “good work, but there’s room for improvement”

    The great thing about the bubble you’ve constructed for yourself is that, if anybody points out the bubble to you, that’s okay, that’s just typical for liberals to look at a round transparent hollow liquid object surrounding a person and refer to it derisively as a bubble.

    “And I never said that saying she is “Spanish” is a substantive position.”

    And yet, whenever anybody asks what the “substantive position” you are defending regarding her actually is, you fall back on “well, the media loves her because she’s Spanish”. The only part of that that that’s about her is that she’s Spanish, and, ordinarily speaking, that would not be considered a substantive critical position, I agree with you.

    Which reminds me of that bit from ‘The Office’, “Do you have anything less offensive you’d rather be called, other than Mexican?”

  63. (this is exhausting)

    Let’s start over.

    I don’t have a fucking position on Obama’s pick for SCOTUS. It’s his pick. He’s the President. That’s what presidents get to do. And a president’s pick for the SC should be approved, unless there is something really horrible discovered about the person’s past opinions or rulings. (or if he might be pro-life and you’re worried about your NOW money drying up)

    And since I seem to be the only person on here that knows Dennis Miller’s ACTUAL opinion of Sotomayer based on more than simply a clip posted on Media Matters, which is, he doesn’t have a strong opinion of her, I felt the need to chime in.

    Miller’s attempt at humor was based on his feeling that at the time of this segment airing, the only thing we were learning about her was that she was Hispanic.

    THAT IS ALL.

    JESUS.

    But I’m sure that won’t stop one of you from posting something along the lines of “Well Travis, your buddy Rush was saying…..”

    Ya’ll are just fucking with me, aren’t you?

  64. “That is all… except for comments 34, 37, and then 55, and my point in comment 71 about Miguel Estrata, and of course the point I was trying to make (which apparently had nothing to do with Miller, why would anybody assume I was talking about Miller?) was that any substantive criticism is being shot down because she’s Latina, (even though I don’t know of any specific substantive criticism). But apart from that…”

    (What have the romans ever done for us?)

    What I mean is, if that was your whole point, I’m pretty confused by the various other posts you have made in this thread which seem to be trying to make stabs at other points.

    That said, it certainly seems as if Miller is mocking a specific thing about her and it has nothing to do with the media. Now, I know *you* don’t listen to right-wing talking points at all (of course), but the whole meme about “oh she’s *proud* to be a Mexican or whatever, is she?” was a pretty big right-wing talking point, and he’s busting it out, and people are calling him out on it. That is what he’s saying — and we both agree, it is non-substantive criticism, which is why people are criticizing him for it. If he said it even though he himself doesn’t believe it, then more the shame, ’cause he’s a panderer, and the one thing that could always be said about Miller was that he was too obscure to be a panderer.

  65. messiahcomplexio wrote:

    In my eyes, Bill Maher is moving down this same path…

    Maher’s certainly managing to beat two of his pet causes–hatred of religion and dislike of processed food–to death. And, particularly where religion is concerned, he tends to cut off people (i.e. Cornel West) who mount a spirited rebuttal.

  66. Well, apologies if I wake up tomorrow and my speechifying is plastered all over this thread. I’ve tried to submit my comment for the past twenty minutes, breaking it up any number of ways, but get only error messages.

  67. Of course, that one works. I’ll try one last time.

    Mr. Crabtree,

    I must say, you have a remarkable winning percentage when criticizing comments that have not yet been made. So I hopefully won’t waste anyone’s time with those.

    What I will say about Mr. Miller is that I don’t particularly buy his (or your) interpretation of the joke. Nor do I put much stock in his after-the-fact explanation that you relayed, just as I wouldn’t any liberal personality’s in a comparable position. Anytime a public figure makes a controversial statement and takes heat for it, the natural reaction is to come up with any excuse that might defuse the situation.

  68. Now, he should probably regard my skepticism as some sort of compliment (albeit backhanded), since his explanation being true would make him an idiot, or at least someone who has paid no attention whatsoever to the issue he has gone on national television to discuss. The morning of the announcement, I woke up and stayed in my room for a few hours, reading. Around noon, realizing I hadn’t eaten anything yet, I headed to the kitchen for some cereal and turned the tv on. Within the first fifteen minutes of sitting there with my Honey Nut Cheerios (I had two bowls), I had seen the news, learned some of her background, followed her path to prominence, listened to proud Hispanic officials sing her praises, watched multiple conservatives express their concern and disdain, and heard mention of two very specific instances that might prove to be stumbling blocks to her confirmation — one being her involvement in the New Haven firefighters ruling and the other her aforementioned comments on her heritage and life experience. That was in fifteen minutes.

    I left the tv on for the next few hours while doing things around the house. I did no extensive research on the matter. I didn’t search around the internet. All information was ascertained from mainstream news networks, and only that which seeped into my brain while I was tending to other things. But even still, I heard those same things several times throughout the day. So, no, I disagree with your (and, if I take him at his/your word, Miller’s) assertion that all the media talked about was her background as a strong Hispanic woman. I think that’s pretty clearly a bogus claim.

  69. When I first heard Miller’s joke, I had a completely different (and, I thought, natural) interpretation of its meaning. He did not just say, “I am a latino woman!” He, I think, was pretty clearly referencing (“not nearly as textured,” etc.) Judge Sotomayor’s comments (and not, by extension, the media’s treatment of her). Still, I have to wonder if he looked at all into the context of her remarks. She did not say that a Latina woman lived a richer life, made a better judge, or even made better decisions than a white man. She said that she “hoped” such better conclusions would be drawn, and those framed specifically within the context of a discrimination case featuring another Latina woman. (She later cites instances when white men have, of course, reached these “better conclusions.”) In the same speech, she also talks of guarding against one’s own “opinions, sympathies, and prejudices,” and aspiring to impartiality. So while her comments do resemble Justice Alito’s previous remarks about perspective being shaped by personal history, I actually find Sotomayor’s to be more nuanced. All this is to say that either Miller was ignorant to the context or he has some serious deficiencies when it comes to his reading comprehension skills.

    Since you’ve reframed the argument several times now to be only about Miller, I’ll leave my thoughts on the matter there. Sorry for the lengthy, indulgent post, but you’ve had about twenty of them and I just this one (or four).

  70. The nomination of Sonia Sotomayor is the most obvious case of identity politics I’ve ever seen. It may be a good thing but it’s obvious and ripe for political commentators to make fun of.

    Does anyone think for one second Obama didn’t say these exact words “give me a list of potential nominees that are female and latino”. I wonder if a Latino judge may have gotten overlooked because their name didn’t sound Spanish enough. I can picture it now “There is a perfect canidate in New Mexico that is female, latino and very accomplished. But she got married 20 years ago and her last name is Smith”. Obama “Do you have a picture?” . “Uh oh, she’s pretty light skinned, Next!”.

    By the way Crabtree your a jerk, I like Michael Bay.

  71. MDOC: The nomination of Clarence Thomas to replace Marshall was FAR more obvious. How many black conservative justices did Bush senior have to choose from? Sotomayor may have gotten the edge over others because she fit the perfect demo, but you can’t argue she isn’t qualified. She’s so qualified, in fact, that the GOP tried to block her nomination ten years ago because they were afraid she’d be a future Supreme Court pick.

  72. It’s been said:

    Apparently the only way to avoid “identity politics” is to pick white men for every job.

    “The nomination of Sonia Sotomayor is the most obvious case of identity politics I’ve ever seen.”

    Really? Got your eyesight back in January or something? Does anyone think for one second BushSr didn’t say these exact words “give me a list of potential nominees that are right wing fucktards and black”. Does anyone think for one second BushJr didn’t say these exact words “give me a list of potential nominees that are right wing fucktards and female”. Does anyone think for one second BushJr didn’t say these exact words “what there aren’t any qualified female right wing fucktards? Well there’s always my LapDog Harriet, that’s the ticket”.

  73. If elected President I will appoint a lesbian Eskimo to the Supreme Court.

    Crabtree in ’12!

    And I will buy a large popcorn at the Arclight for anyone who can identify the cinematic origin of my name.

  74. Who will be the 100th Commenter?

    Who?

    Said commenter will receive a limited edition signed head shot of Jeffrey Wells.

  75. I can’t really express how relieved I am that this thread devolved into a political pissing contest; the prospect of 100 comments solely on the state of Dennis Miller’s “comedy” in 2009 would have been a surefire sign of the apocalypse.

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